How would you score it.

[Xrayaries]

I have seen many different scoring calls on this what is the correct call?

Runner at 3rd. After the pitch catcher throws to pitcher and it goes over her head. Runner scores from third.

1. Catcher error, unearned run?
2. Catcher error, stolen base, earned run?
3. Catcher error, stolen base,unearned run?

What are you thoughts on scoring this? I would score it #1

I chose not to do a poll because I would like to hear your thoughts on why?

 

[CARDS]

To me it would be the same as if the catcher did an errant throw down to third base and resulted in a run...Catcher error unearned run.
To me SB would only come into play with an actual attempt. Example: Runner breaks for home stops, catcher returns ball to pitcher and the runner continues home generally as the pitcher looks down or turns their back on the runner.

 

[DanMaz]

score it # 1 -- (unless my dd was catching then it would be E on pitcher.) DOH! catch the ball pithcer!! lol JK JK JK just joking!

 

[Captain_Thunder]

Error on Catcher
Wouldn't it depend on what happens the rest of the inning, whether it is earned or unearned.
If next pitch is Strike 3, 3 Outs - Unearned
If next pitch is hit over the fence - IMO runner would have then scored, so it would be an Earned Run!

 

[Xrayaries]

Error on Catcher
Wouldn't it depend on what happens the rest of the inning, whether it is earned or unearned.
If next pitch is Strike 3, 3 Outs - Unearned
If next pitch is hit over the fence - IMO runner would have then scored, so it would be an Earned Run!

I see the logic. I'm not sold on an errant throw ever being scored an earned run.

I love listening to baseball on the radio. The broadcasters would always disagree with the scoring ruling on a play. It just shows how judgement plays a roll at every level.

 

[DanMaz]

yes thunder. agree. you actually have to let the inning play out to know if the run is earned or not. Reconstruct the inning once it is over to see how it would have played without the error to help determine earned or not earned runs. so if the next batter hits a HR -- both runs are earned. If the next batter k's that run that scored from the overthrown ball is not earned. i beleive this is correct.

 

[DanMaz]

by reconstructing it... imagine no error thrown... runner would still be on 3rd. next batter hits HR. both runs score = 2 earned runs.

imagine no error runner still on 3rd and next batter k's for the 3rd out, runner would not have scored = unearned run. sounds weird but i think its correct. plz correct me if i miss it.

 

[24GahannaLadyLions7]

I agree with Thunder and Maz... you have to let the inning play out....

 

[Xrayaries]

I see what your saying but the runner scores on an errant throw. That run counts as unearned. Unearned to me means the runner scores based on an error. The possibility of getting an out before the runner scored has changed. Is the errant throw still and error?

 

[IRdad09]

I would say error on the catcher and certainly an unearned run. In my opinion, by no means am I an expert score keeper, but would the book be closed on the chance of additional unearned runs. At least from that play. This wasn't a play attempting to get a base runner out and no additional players reached base. Run scored, error on the catcher, unearned, coaches yell at catcher and everyone moves on. Oh and no stolen base.

 

[DanMaz]

pulled this from NCAA softball rule book.

you have to be a lawyer to understand a lot of this stuff!!
makes my head hurt! lol

Extracted in entirety from Rule 14 in NCAA Softball Rules and Interpretations Book
SECTION 24—EARNED/UNEARNED RUNS 14.24.1 Earned runs are runs for which the pitcher is statistically accountable. An earned run shall be charged against the pitcher when a runner scores as a result of: a base on balls, a fielder’s choice, a hit, a putout, a batter hit by a pitch, an illegal pitch, a sacrifice bunt (including a slap and running slap), a sacrifice fly, a stolen base and a wild pitch (including a third-strike wild pitch). Earned runs are charged only in the event that the defense did not have the opportunity to make the third putout. Earned runs are determined by reconstructing the inning as if there were no errors or passed balls. The pitcher should be given the benefit of the doubt in determining the advancement of runners had the defensive team been errorless. Any pitcher who is replaced is charged with earned runs for which she is totally responsible. Note: A batter who gets on base as a result of a fielder’s choice can score an earned run only if the runner that was out as a result of the fielder’s choice was a potential earned run.

 

[Xrayaries]

" Earned runs are charged only in the event that the defense did not have the opportunity to make the third putout"

Then immediately says.

"Earned runs are determined by reconstructing the inning as if there were no errors or passed balls."

It's a tad confusing. First quote supports what I say would happen. Second which is all bold supports Thunder and Max. How do you go about reconstructing an inning. I'm confused more so now than before.

 

[Captain_Thunder]

Easy example.
There are 2 outs. Batter hits a Triple!
Catcher throws the 2-2 pitch back to the Pitcher and it goes flying over her head. Run Scores.

#1 - Next pitch is Strike 3 inning over. In that case the Run is Unearned! Because if it wasn't for the throwing error, she wouldn't have scored.
#2 - Batter slams it over Left field fence for a Hone Run!!! Runner would have scored w/o the error, as she would have still been standing on 3B!!! That is an Earned Run!

Really giving the Pitcher the benefit if not replaying the inning and scoring correctly....

 

[IRdad09]

Here is from MLB rule book.
An unearned run is any run that scored because of an error or a passed ball. Oftentimes, it is the judgment of the official scorer as to whether a specific run would've scored without the defensive mishap.
Looks like there is room for interpretation here as well.

 

[PaulP]

Seems like a runner that advances to the next base after seeing a passed ball or wild pitch or throwing/catching error, would not earn a stolen base. Runner should intentionally try to “steal” a base for a stolen base to be possible. If the runner reached the next base because the pitcher couldn’t catch the ball using ordinary care, then the catcher made an error.

Seems fair to wait to see what the next batter does, but I don’t know all of the nuances. Mental mistakes (e.g., outfielder throwing to wrong base or missing a cutoff) are not errors, so a lot comes down to judgement.

 

[DanMaz]

my head hurts more now. lol

 

[coachjwb]

No room for interpretation on this one ... this one is straightforward and consistent at all level of baseball and softball. It's clearly an error on the catcher as her throw was supposed to be to the pitcher, not an overthrow. As others have said, whether it's earned or unearned depends on what happens the rest of the inning. If the run would have scored anyhow if not for the overthrow, it's earned. If not, unearned.

 

[PaulP]

Might be easier to let GameChanger decide if it’s an earned run (just kidding)

 

[Long Baller]

Might be easier to let GameChanger decide if it’s an earned run (just kidding)

That's comedy gold right there.