A mere symptom of what's wrong with travel softball

[Rerun]

I think loyalty was just as bad 10 years ago, there just wasn't as many teams/people doing it. You can agree or disagree but once the Outlaws blew up into this mega Org. is when the shit really hit the fan. They were ruthless when it came to getting players or entire teams. The unfortunate thing is that several others have adapted this style and it's almost become second nature anymore when players leave mid year or a team switches Orgs.

Unfortunately they don’t really have much of a choice any more. But I agree that’s when’s it started to go south.

 

[DanMaz]

I think loyalty was just as bad 10 years ago, there just wasn't as many teams/people doing it. You can agree or disagree but once the Outlaws blew up into this mega Org. is when the shit really hit the fan. They were ruthless when it came to getting players or entire teams. The unfortunate thing is that several others have adapted this style and it's almost become second nature anymore when players leave mid year or a team switches Orgs.

Good post but remember they all made a choice. nobody twisted anyone's arm to join the Outlaws org. They most likely joined because they wanted to follow their dreams of playing at the next level in college and beleive that the Outlaws was a good vehicle to help get them there. Is that wrong? You can have your opinions but to blame it on the outlaws isn't really fair. I have been with the outlaws for a long time almost from the start. Warren grew his part time to a full time org --- was it right? I don't know... Was it nasty? not sure... was it illegal? dont think so. Fastpitch can be ugly nasty mean and down right make you pissed as hell but to blame something on an org or the way he grew it-- well I dont think thats very fair. jealousy maybe on some part? maybe... probably... haters gonna hate and when your on top of the world nobody likes you!~ lol #GO!OUTLAWS! (here comes the hate mail)

 

[Rerun]

Good post but remember they all made a choice. nobody twisted anyone's arm to join the Outlaws org. They most likely joined because they wanted to follow their dreams of playing at the next level in college and beleive that the Outlaws was a good vehicle to help get them there. Is that wrong? You can have your opinions but to blame it on the outlaws isn't really fair. I have been with the outlaws for a long time almost from the start. Warren grew his part time to a full time org --- was it right? I don't know... Was it nasty? not sure... was it illegal? dont think so. Fastpitch can be ugly nasty mean and down right make you pissed as hell but to blame something on an org or the way he grew it-- well I dont think thats very fair. jealousy maybe on some part? maybe... probably... haters gonna hate and when your on top of the world nobody likes you!~ lol #GO!OUTLAWS! (here comes the hate mail)

for someone that’s been around a while you seem unsure about a lot of things. LOL

 

[DanMaz]

well rerun lol... i wasn't in the back room making the deals but i saw many teams and players come over to the dark side! some were just single teams with no org. and wanted to be part of something growing and getting bigger and bigger. It didnt always work out but many did and very many are and became successful in their decision and are playing at the next level including my kid and many of the players we have coached and played with over the years. now with a 12u team i hope to achieve great success with these girls!

 

[HITTER23]

I think loyalty was just as bad 10 years ago, there just wasn't as many teams/people doing it. You can agree or disagree but once the Outlaws blew up into this mega Org. is when the shit really hit the fan. They were ruthless when it came to getting players or entire teams. The unfortunate thing is that several others have adapted this style and it's almost become second nature anymore when players leave mid year or a team switches Orgs.

You cant really make that statement without including the Lasers also, those two pioneered all that you mentioned battling each other. When teams started jumping, it turned into a absolute free for all.

 

[Rerun]

You cant really make that statement without including the Lasers also, those two pioneered all that you mentioned battling each other. When teams started jumping, it turned into a absolute free for all.

Ain’t that the truth, I lost a outstanding SS to the Lazers. But she left because of her daddy not what she wanted. Once she had a car and was 16 she finished out her travel ball career with us. Then went on to college and played until she had a career ending injury.

 

[snoman76]

Good post but remember they all made a choice. nobody twisted anyone's arm to join the Outlaws org. They most likely joined because they wanted to follow their dreams of playing at the next level in college and beleive that the Outlaws was a good vehicle to help get them there. Is that wrong? You can have your opinions but to blame it on the outlaws isn't really fair. I have been with the outlaws for a long time almost from the start. Warren grew his part time to a full time org --- was it right? I don't know... Was it nasty? not sure... was it illegal? dont think so. Fastpitch can be ugly nasty mean and down right make you pissed as hell but to blame something on an org or the way he grew it-- well I dont think thats very fair. jealousy maybe on some part? maybe... probably... haters gonna hate and when your on top of the world nobody likes you!~ lol #GO!OUTLAWS! (here comes the hate mail)

You're 100% right, they did make the choice to go there. I don't think I was blaming the Outlaws 100%, more so that they took it to the next level. I have no problem with Warren doing what he did. He grew his brand..

 

[snoman76]

Ain’t that the truth, I lost a outstanding SS to the Lazers. But she left because of her daddy not what she wanted. Once she had a car and was 16 she finished out her travel ball career with us. Then went on to college and played until she had a career ending injury.

I hate when parents get involved..lol I mean they have to to some degree but in the end if it's about the girls then why not let them decide where and who they play for?

 

[Morgan Sky]

I hate when parents get involved..lol I mean they have to to some degree but in the end if it's about the girls then why not let them decide where and who they play for?

Didn't you "hang me and my dd" a few posts ago about letting my dd make a decision?

 

[snoman76]

Didn't you "hang me and my dd" a few posts ago about letting my dd make a decision?

That was about honoring your commitment for that 1 year. What I'm referring to here is after the family honors their commitment but feels a change is needed the player should get the deciding vote.

 

[Captain_Thunder]

My daughter quit her team last week. 100% her decision. Was the team the 'right fit'- Yes. Did she play almost 100% of innings-Yes. Did she bat in the 4 hole-Yes. Did she play on one of the top 12u teams in Ohio- Yes. Why did she quit? As these girls are maturing as young women, some things they just don't respond to anymore. She love her coaches and teammates?- Yes. But as these girls get older there comes a time when the decision has to be theirs, 100%. I might not agree with it 100%but have to support it 100%. She is the one on the field playing, and I'm not living through her successes and failures, I had my own 30 years ago. I just love to watch her play and do her thing on the field, win or lose. So in my eyes it's ok to quit at anytime, they can't play tight and scared.

I have read this a few times now and trying to figure it out???
According to what you wrote, your DD was the star (or one of the top stars) of the team.
On a Top Team, Playing every inning, batting clean-up, everything sounds great on the field.
So I can only imagine it has to do with personalities of the girls - to decide to leave this situation with only 2 or so months left in the season.
This game is for the girls! We know your DD is happy, but with all good, how does this effect the other 8-12 girls on that team? I feel for them - but I don't know the whole story!
But from what I read, I can't understand the reasoning???

 

[coachjwb]

I'm not on here as much as I used to be, and admittedly am not following the local softball scene really at all these days, but I still love the game so I'll still give my 2 cents.

I didn't like the poaching that sometimes happened when I coached baseball or softball, nor did I like when players left teams mid-season, or would I have let my kids do that. Just because some organizations and coaches aren't always loyal to players from one season to the next, I don't think that justifies players, often totally pushed by their parents, to leave a team mid-season. Of course if the players or their parents aren't happy with the coach for some reason, they should privately discuss it with them, and not gripe about it within the team or outside of it. As parents, I think we need to teach our children to follow-through on their commitments, whether it be in sports, school, other outside activities, or even work when they get a little older. And for those coaches who are so arrogant as to think only they can be the ones who helps a player achieve their long-term goals, they need to get over themselves.

Can coaches and organizations make a difference ... yes, absolutely, but they shouldn't go poaching mid-season and absolutely destroy the chemistry of other teams, and make it seem like that's OK to do. Again, just my two cents ... you can call me old-school if you want, but that's the way I raised my kids, and I know that's they way they're raising theirs.

 

[tjsmize3]

Didn't you "hang me and my dd" a few posts ago about letting my dd make a decision?

With all due respect MS, snoman did not "hang you" for letting your daughter make a decision, it was for letting her make a clearly bad decision. You said that you up and left in the middle of a season on a team that was: "the right fit, playing almost 100% of innings, batted in the 4 hole, and played on one of the top 12u teams in Ohio, as well as loved her coaches and teammates." If she wanted to "100%" steal the coach's car I would hope you could intervene there. I think people in this post MOSTLY are making a value judgement and saying because of the implications it has to other payers and their families, in only very dire circumstances would you allow a child to leave a team mid-season. You did not paint a picture of very dire circumstances so it appears you allowed your DD to pull the rug out on other parents when they probably did not deserve it.

Also, shame on you snoman! I coached in the Outlaws org for years and you know first hand we all used to make sure your org and my org talked to each other in regards to who was calling us looking to jump. Josh and I used to talk all through tryouts to make sure we weren't "stealing" a player from each other. I know that sounds absolutely nuts from today's standards, but that's what we did out of respect for the game and each other. Saying this "all started with the Outlaws" is not very fair.

 

[snoman76]

Also, shame on you snoman! I coached in the Outlaws org for years and you know first hand we all used to make sure your org and my org talked to each other in regards to who was calling us looking to jump. Josh and I used to talk all through tryouts to make sure we weren't "stealing" a player from each other. I know that sounds absolutely nuts from today's standards, but that's what we did out of respect for the game and each other. Saying this "all started with the Outlaws" is not very fair.

Tom, that post was in no way directed towards you. Unfortunately not all coaches were like that. Also, I clarified later saying it was more taking it to the next level rather than starting it. I know you still wont agree and that's fine, it's just my observation and opinion. Some may agree with me and some won't...

 

[CARDS]

This was included in a post today by a coach seeking players: "If you're not happy with your current situation or it's not the right fit for you, give us a try." A coach actually advocating that a player quit her team, at this late date, to join his team. I'm not interested in arguing about this with anyone. It is flat-out wrong on so many levels.

Look at many want ads for jobs? yep the same thing is posted.

 

[CARDS]

I think loyalty is dying in the sport of softball all around. That is the reason that Athletes Unlimited used a structure of meaningless games and silly points for individuals. Things are just different today. It would be great to return to the good old days when softball was a pastime and the top players were just as good as the year round players today. Everyone is looking for their "spot" and if things aren't quite right, they go searching again. Coaches are always on the lookout too.

Even this site is a disappointment. I would love to come to this site and read about the results of games, tournaments, and players that are doing well. Instead, it is mostly about facilitating these player/team movements.

Softball as a whole is shrinking at all levels... If it keeps up there will be no ladies fastpitch as we once known it in 5/10 years.

 

[hititwhereitspitched]

Look at many want ads for jobs? yep the same thing is posted.

Playing girls' softball is not a job .... good grief.

 

[hititwhereitspitched]

Softball as a whole is shrinking at all levels... If it keeps up there will be no ladies fastpitch as we once known it in 5/10 years.

When you join a TEAM, you honor your commitment to the TEAM. As others pointed out, it's a 1-year deal unless you were promised otherwise. Softball is a TEAM sport. Do what's best for your daughter in the confines of a TEAM sport. It's not OK if "everyone is doing it" (quitting mid-seasons etc.). When I first posted, I knew I didn't want to argue the point. The fact that so many come up with reasons to rationalize is disheartening, yet not surprising.

 

[Rerun]

Softball as a whole is shrinking at all levels... If it keeps up there will be no ladies fastpitch as we once known it in 5/10 years.

As rec-leagues fall, travel ball falls. May just take a little longer but it’s coming.

 

[DanMaz]

As rec-leagues fall, travel ball falls. May just take a little longer but it’s coming.

not sure why some think softball will be gone in 5 years... our local rec. is bigger than it has been in the last decade.
why do some think it is fading away?