Bat rolling, and shaving. Really??? (The Softball Zone Radio Show Thread of the Week)
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
I'm sure the players parents or coach would have no problem letting the opposition choose the bat she uses. It definitely isn't the bat with that girl. She is a BEAST!!!!
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
I am also guessing like many girls, she has several bats in her bag, so the fact that she had a different bat this week means nothing. My daughter has four in her bag, as well as most of my players have multiple bats. Mindset of player....Player gets in slump, pulls out different bat to change her mindset to hopefully break out of slump. Player is on a hot streak, player continues to use that bat. Also, player may have a lighter bat in the bag for faster pitchers. Different bat means nothing.
I am also guessing like many girls, she has several bats in her bag, so the fact that she had a different bat this week means nothing. My daughter has four in her bag, as well as most of my players have multiple bats. Mindset of player....Player gets in slump, pulls out different bat to change her mindset to hopefully break out of slump. Player is on a hot streak, player continues to use that bat. Also, player may have a lighter bat in the bag for faster pitchers. Different bat means nothing.
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This may be the most epic OFC post of all time. It's like the OFC Apocalypse!!! Who will survive to carry on OFC when the smoke clears???
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
I already said what I think the solution should be. Anyone with information that someone is using an altered bat should report it and let the sanctioning bodies investigate. I agree that bat exit speed is indeed legislated (as it should be) and penalties can and will be given if altered bats are found. You trust the people who write the regs, but apparently you don't trust them to enforce it.
Of course it's subject to change, but at the moment we have zero proven cases and some back channel whispering. Yes, I think we should wait until the percentage of players proven to be using altered bats is greater than 0.
What is your suggested solution?
I already said what I think the solution should be. Anyone with information that someone is using an altered bat should report it and let the sanctioning bodies investigate. I agree that bat exit speed is indeed legislated (as it should be) and penalties can and will be given if altered bats are found. You trust the people who write the regs, but apparently you don't trust them to enforce it.
Of course it's subject to change, but at the moment we have zero proven cases and some back channel whispering. Yes, I think we should wait until the percentage of players proven to be using altered bats is greater than 0.
What is your suggested solution?
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
Funny how this thread affects the game . Yesterday, very unfortunately , my biggest, strongest kid lined a shot back up the middle and caught the pitcher in the hip area . I was unable to attend that game but my assitants said the girl was very dazed and had to be helped off. Even though it was my big power hitter and everyone on my team swings a different bat the blue did an inspection of her bat , which I don't mind at all. But under regular circumstance that wouldn't happen . Glad to say the kid was able to return to play later .
Funny how this thread affects the game . Yesterday, very unfortunately , my biggest, strongest kid lined a shot back up the middle and caught the pitcher in the hip area . I was unable to attend that game but my assitants said the girl was very dazed and had to be helped off. Even though it was my big power hitter and everyone on my team swings a different bat the blue did an inspection of her bat , which I don't mind at all. But under regular circumstance that wouldn't happen . Glad to say the kid was able to return to play later .
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
also this isn't " much ado about nothing" its not 1 % . while it may not be an overall 10% but if there is any team out taking a shot at bending the rules they need to be flushed out . There just isn't any room for that. Girls are better trained , and not getting smaller . Just play by the rules and check the ego's .
also this isn't " much ado about nothing" its not 1 % . while it may not be an overall 10% but if there is any team out taking a shot at bending the rules they need to be flushed out . There just isn't any room for that. Girls are better trained , and not getting smaller . Just play by the rules and check the ego's .
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
At this point, I think most everyone is in agreement that altering bats for youth softball players is not only illegal per sanctioning rules, but morally and ethically wrong. Perhaps a few people didn't really think about it before in terms of the increased risk of injury that could result, and/or some people thought or were led to believe that everyone is doing it. Personally, I was not really familiar with the practice and naive to the fact that it might be going on in the sport. I am now educated as hopefully a lot of other people as well, including tournament directors and umpires.
I agree that at this point in the game that we need to turn it over to the officials above and let them enforce it. And if it is found to be occurring I hope that the offenders are punished to the full extent allowable, including banning from tournaments and participation under the sanctioning bodies.
At this point, I think most everyone is in agreement that altering bats for youth softball players is not only illegal per sanctioning rules, but morally and ethically wrong. Perhaps a few people didn't really think about it before in terms of the increased risk of injury that could result, and/or some people thought or were led to believe that everyone is doing it. Personally, I was not really familiar with the practice and naive to the fact that it might be going on in the sport. I am now educated as hopefully a lot of other people as well, including tournament directors and umpires.
I agree that at this point in the game that we need to turn it over to the officials above and let them enforce it. And if it is found to be occurring I hope that the offenders are punished to the full extent allowable, including banning from tournaments and participation under the sanctioning bodies.
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
Longball do you not work for a sporting good company that also rolls bats! [/QUOTE said:
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
Please point to the post where I mentioned I didn't trust the associations to enforce it. I have never advocated any additional tests or regulations. I might have pointed to what is done in SP - but I don't think any of that is viable in our sport. You have me confused with other posters. The only line I have taken, and will continue to support is the one where if you know of someone doing it - report them and call them out. Plain and simple.
You are very misguided if you think there are no proven cases mentioned on here. You might not be part of the PM updates - but as many know there are emails and texts from concerned parents that have been approached. And I guess having a coach and business owner admit to doing it doesn't qualify as being proven under your criteria.
Just for S&G's which team are you associated with?
Please point to the post where I mentioned I didn't trust the associations to enforce it. I have never advocated any additional tests or regulations. I might have pointed to what is done in SP - but I don't think any of that is viable in our sport. You have me confused with other posters. The only line I have taken, and will continue to support is the one where if you know of someone doing it - report them and call them out. Plain and simple.
You are very misguided if you think there are no proven cases mentioned on here. You might not be part of the PM updates - but as many know there are emails and texts from concerned parents that have been approached. And I guess having a coach and business owner admit to doing it doesn't qualify as being proven under your criteria.
Just for S&G's which team are you associated with?
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
Giggles is right. You think I am the coach of the Bugtussle Scorpions! That's funny stuff if ya knew me.
(that is a smiley face next to that!)
No, I'm not associated with any team. I used to coach for a while but haven't for 6 years. Took up umpiring and happily watched one of my kids pitch 4 years in college. My younger daughter played 10U and 12U, had some back issues and now just plays HS ball in season only. As I have previously said, I have no dog in this fight aside from the proverbial "love of the game".
In post 215 you said "My guess is your one of the wait and see guys. Sad." Pardon me for interpreting that as meaning you don't trust the sanctioning bodies to investigate any reasonable accusations that they may receive and "wait and see" what comes of it. My question now is why is it "sad" when I advocate that, yet that is exactly what you are suggesting. Seems to me like we agree on the solution.
You are correct, I am not in the know on these proven cases. Hopefully this evidence has been forwarded to the appropriate people. What action was taken by any sanctioning body in these proven cases? Is it still being investigated officially?
I didn't see a coach/business owner admit to altering FP bats. I did see one that could have done it but denies doing so. Did I miss another post? I'm, one of these nuts that would rather see 10 guilty people walking the streets before 1 innocent person is punished for something they didn't do. I'm very much in favor of some burden of proof. If a bank gets robbed and someone says you did it and you deny it, are we supposed to put you in jail based on the fact you could have done it?
A little math might explain my cavalier seeming attitude. Maybe my numbers are way off, but here we go anyway. (feel free to correct me) I figure my kid got hit by a batted ball once every 1000 pitches. (None of them resulted in more than a bruise thankfully.) That's a 99.9% chance of NOT getting hit. If everyone used an altered bat and using said bat doubled the chance of my kid getting hit, it now means there is a 99.8% chance of her NOT getting hit. I can still live with that.
On edit, that 1 per 1000 can't be right. That would be every 7-8 games and it was way less than that. But we'll go with it for grins.
If 5% of players are using altered bats, that means on average EVERY GAME has an altered bat. (1 every 20 players) If 1% are using altered bats, that means EVERY TOURNAMENT has several players using altered bats. (1 per 10 teams of 10 players) Do you folks in the know really think there are that many doing it? I honestly don't know, but in my little world up north, I've never seen it or heard of it. That's a story every umpire would tell and I know a fair amount of umpires. Would it shock me if there was an isolated incident? Not at all.
This is the best numbers I could come up with. Between 1973 and 1995 there were 88 kids between 5 and 15 killed playing baseball from all causes. Didn't find softball numbers. Pretty rare given the numbers of participants. In 2011 alone, there were 650 kids age 12 and under killed in motor vehicle accidents. The risk isn't even comparable, yet we all take it. How many of those kids would still be alive if they were just wearing a helmet or maybe had a roll cage instead of a cup holder? If safety is the number 1 priority, then go after the low hanging fruit first!
I hate the thought of cheating. I also hate (perhaps even more) what has already been mentioned by ManitouDan of suspicions flying around that are based on nothing at all. Please, report and root these people out if you have evidence. If you don't, then raising suspicions does nothing for anybody.
Giggles is right. You think I am the coach of the Bugtussle Scorpions! That's funny stuff if ya knew me.
(that is a smiley face next to that!) No, I'm not associated with any team. I used to coach for a while but haven't for 6 years. Took up umpiring and happily watched one of my kids pitch 4 years in college. My younger daughter played 10U and 12U, had some back issues and now just plays HS ball in season only. As I have previously said, I have no dog in this fight aside from the proverbial "love of the game".
In post 215 you said "My guess is your one of the wait and see guys. Sad." Pardon me for interpreting that as meaning you don't trust the sanctioning bodies to investigate any reasonable accusations that they may receive and "wait and see" what comes of it. My question now is why is it "sad" when I advocate that, yet that is exactly what you are suggesting. Seems to me like we agree on the solution.
You are correct, I am not in the know on these proven cases. Hopefully this evidence has been forwarded to the appropriate people. What action was taken by any sanctioning body in these proven cases? Is it still being investigated officially?
I didn't see a coach/business owner admit to altering FP bats. I did see one that could have done it but denies doing so. Did I miss another post? I'm, one of these nuts that would rather see 10 guilty people walking the streets before 1 innocent person is punished for something they didn't do. I'm very much in favor of some burden of proof. If a bank gets robbed and someone says you did it and you deny it, are we supposed to put you in jail based on the fact you could have done it?
A little math might explain my cavalier seeming attitude. Maybe my numbers are way off, but here we go anyway.
(feel free to correct me) I figure my kid got hit by a batted ball once every 1000 pitches. (None of them resulted in more than a bruise thankfully.) That's a 99.9% chance of NOT getting hit. If everyone used an altered bat and using said bat doubled the chance of my kid getting hit, it now means there is a 99.8% chance of her NOT getting hit. I can still live with that. On edit, that 1 per 1000 can't be right. That would be every 7-8 games and it was way less than that. But we'll go with it for grins.
If 5% of players are using altered bats, that means on average EVERY GAME has an altered bat. (1 every 20 players) If 1% are using altered bats, that means EVERY TOURNAMENT has several players using altered bats. (1 per 10 teams of 10 players) Do you folks in the know really think there are that many doing it? I honestly don't know, but in my little world up north, I've never seen it or heard of it. That's a story every umpire would tell and I know a fair amount of umpires.
Would it shock me if there was an isolated incident? Not at all. This is the best numbers I could come up with. Between 1973 and 1995 there were 88 kids between 5 and 15 killed playing baseball from all causes. Didn't find softball numbers. Pretty rare given the numbers of participants. In 2011 alone, there were 650 kids age 12 and under killed in motor vehicle accidents. The risk isn't even comparable, yet we all take it. How many of those kids would still be alive if they were just wearing a helmet or maybe had a roll cage instead of a cup holder? If safety is the number 1 priority, then go after the low hanging fruit first!
I hate the thought of cheating. I also hate (perhaps even more) what has already been mentioned by ManitouDan of suspicions flying around that are based on nothing at all. Please, report and root these people out if you have evidence. If you don't, then raising suspicions does nothing for anybody.
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
I am obviously na?ve about the whole altered/rolled bat issue. That's why I asked in the 2nd post of this thread how you could test for altered bats. After reading through the posts and watching some videos on Youtube I think I'm catching up. Again, maybe I'm na?ve, but in 7 years of select ball I have never personally seen, or suspected anyone of using an altered bat. I don't believe it to be a wide spread issue in my experience. Having said that, I admit to being out of touch with younger age groups. Am I understanding this to be an issue with the up and comers? This thread also has me thinking about the numerous posts I've seen for 8-10 year old bats selling for well above the original retail price...this bat is super hot...one of the hottest bats ever made...rare, hot, and hard to find...you get my point. I'm not suggesting anyone was selling altered bats. It's just the fact that they may be grandfathered, or have gotten hotter over time. Bottom line is most know they would not pass the criteria of new bats today. Why is this any different? Just my thoughts and opinion...
I am obviously na?ve about the whole altered/rolled bat issue. That's why I asked in the 2nd post of this thread how you could test for altered bats. After reading through the posts and watching some videos on Youtube I think I'm catching up. Again, maybe I'm na?ve, but in 7 years of select ball I have never personally seen, or suspected anyone of using an altered bat. I don't believe it to be a wide spread issue in my experience. Having said that, I admit to being out of touch with younger age groups. Am I understanding this to be an issue with the up and comers? This thread also has me thinking about the numerous posts I've seen for 8-10 year old bats selling for well above the original retail price...this bat is super hot...one of the hottest bats ever made...rare, hot, and hard to find...you get my point. I'm not suggesting anyone was selling altered bats. It's just the fact that they may be grandfathered, or have gotten hotter over time. Bottom line is most know they would not pass the criteria of new bats today. Why is this any different? Just my thoughts and opinion...
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
Oh sorry longball I noticed a lot of old posts you posted were selling bats... Is that the new name for your alarms.. I mean u did use the word hot! To describe it
Oh sorry longball I noticed a lot of old posts you posted were selling bats... Is that the new name for your alarms.. I mean u did use the word hot! To describe it
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(The Softball Zone Radio Show Thread of the Week)
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Tuesday night Show Thread of the Week, join the show and listed or chat in the chat room or call in and talk about this Thread.
Show Starts at 8:00 p.m. Tuesday Night 05.27.14
Follow this Link TalkShoe Community Call Voice Chat Group Calling Teleconference Calling once you get to Talkshoe click the Live Now Button and Look for "The Softball Zone Radio Show" Click on the Show Link or Clicking here TalkShoe Community Call will take you straight to the Show Page
Caller Welcome at any time during the Show.
Phone Number: (724) 444-7444
Call ID: 35639
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
If I was innocent and didn't have anything to hide I would have replied to this post. These are very straight-forward questions that should be easily answered.
Len
If I was innocent and didn't have anything to hide I would have replied to this post. These are very straight-forward questions that should be easily answered.
Len
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
One of them is a Mako that is so bad, DD doesn't want to sell it even though she has outgrown it.
Yes, I have sold a lot of bats. My DD shares my interest in bats and we buy and sell our fair share. I am getting ready to post up 3 out of her bag, but they are not hot, they s u c k, so they should sell fast.
One of them is a Mako that is so bad, DD doesn't want to sell it even though she has outgrown it.
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Re: Bat rolling, and shaving. Really???
I am assuming you are joking about Mako. Because either my DDs old bat was dead or the Mako is pretty hot. She was killing the ball this weekend before her hand got busted open by a throw (super freak accident).
Yes, I have sold a lot of bats. My DD shares my interest in bats and we buy and sell our fair share. I am getting ready to post up 3 out of her bag, but they are not hot, they s u c k, so they should sell fast.
I am assuming you are joking about Mako. Because either my DDs old bat was dead or the Mako is pretty hot. She was killing the ball this weekend before her hand got busted open by a throw (super freak accident).
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I'll make the assumption that BAD in this case means "good" if she doen't want to get rid of it. Hope your DD is Ok.
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