What does a team name get you?

Discussion in 'Softball Parent Discussions' started by Hink1927, Apr 2, 2017.

  1. Hink1927

    Hink1927 New Member

    This is out 3rd year of travel ball. I am struggling with the benefits of playing for a particular team. So far it is just a name on a jersey. No contact from the organization, no benefit to my daughter, no nothing. Is this normal? What does playing for a 'good' organization supposed to do for the player? Our team has hosted a tournament and got no help from the organization. We did everything and even had to pay the organization for the facility use. What am I missing?
    kc0602 likes this.
  2. CARDS

    CARDS Active Member

    Just having teams or getting into events does not guarantee that an organization can fulfill the expectations of parents or players. It pretty much evolves around the coach....

    The advantage with playing for a larger organization will vary depending on what the goals are for that organization. Some are better than others. IMO there are only a handful of organizations in each major Ohio city that have the experience and coaches that can grow young players and get older players and parents good advice for college exposure. There seems to be more where they just have teams, play events and a organization head makes a profit from uniform,equipment or facility usage.

    Experienced coaches are a must if you are looking to play on a team for development 8U to 14U or college recruitment 14U and above. During tryouts look for the coach to be honest on what the goals of the team are and how they plan to achieve those goals.

    I would suggest that as you look for teams in the fall or, get to address some concerns this spring ask some critical questions:
    1. What are the Coaches connections, experience, training and certifications.
    2. How many coaches on the team or organization are part of a coaching network? NFCA, Coach Book etc...Do they work any camps?
    3. What were some previous events played and finishes.
    4. Does the coach have any practice plans available to review?
    5. Does the coach have a good system of record keeping for finances?
    6. Does the coach use a stat tracker system that is reconciled? How do they track growth during practices/games?
    7. Does the organization provide additional opportunities for fundraising, Bulk purchases, training/softball school, year around facilities, track record of events.
  3. Jkb69933

    Jkb69933 Member

    I think the reason you play with a big name organization is to play with better talent and better coaching. That would be the hope, obviously not always the case.
  4. Hilliarddad3

    Hilliarddad3 Active Member

    Go with what Cards stated and don't be fooled by the term "Nationals".... Everybody and their brother names a tourney World Series or Nationals.... Now ASA and PGF are the real ones to watch for..... Everything else is mostly noise.... But ask yourself what is your daughter doing to promote herself if she has aspirations to play in college. And how are her grades as that's more important than anything.....
  5. wow

    wow Active Member

    Agree with Cards on this. Here is another tid bit. All the big name organizations have coaches who are doing this for the 2nd, 3rd, or 4th time though. Connections and coaches who know what events to be in, have personal relationships with colleges, and can speak on yr kids behalf is very important.

    Its a total package yr looking for. Larger organizations play the biggest events. IN Ohio its the Outlaws and Lasers. Outside Ohio its Bandits, Ga impact, Tx impact, Ca BB, and many many others. Just watch where these types of teams go. The best teams run in the relatively the same circles.

    Here's the caveat. The oweness is on the parents & player. Just because you make a "BIG" name team does not mean you have arrived. Its one step. Just one. Like Hillarddad already stated.

    What's so funny is all the consolidation the closer the college years get.
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2017
  6. cobb_of_fury

    cobb_of_fury Member

    BE CAREFUL - Some of the NAMED Organization have (lets say) - "Other" Teams that kinda fill out the brackets - and may or may not be equivalent to the rest of the organization -

    It is you and your daughters job to do the leg work - no organization will just get you a scholarship - They may be able to put you in position to be seen - They may talk to coaches - Their organization name may carry some weight.
    but it's your DD job to make contact with coaches - Talk to them and keep them up to date on where she's is playing.
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2017
  7. mike_dyer

    mike_dyer Member

    I've liked exactly 2 posts here, brah.

    You made both of them.

    The moral of the story is most people see outLOLs instead of outlaws...
  8. bowser

    bowser New Member

    Yea Mike! In fact I bet the HC's @ ND, Ohio U., YSU, Pitt, St. Francis, Marshall, Akron, PSU, Tenn., and on and on agree with your observation
  9. cobb_of_fury

    cobb_of_fury Member

    Bowser - I have - a real question not a smart ass quip; Did the organization MAKE those girls or did those girls MAKE the organization? Is it the chicken or the egg?

    This next one is also a real question; How many of those girls played with that one organization since 10U?/ 12U? / 14U? / 16U? - I don't know and I'm not planning on looking it up - If someone knows please post it here.

    but off the top of my head - I'm guessing they all came to the organization in high school after they were on the path to be who they became- I could be wrong - If so please let me know.
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2017
  10. coachtomv

    coachtomv Active Member

    "What does a team name get you?", it gets you criticized and bashed apparently, lol. Don't hate the player, hate the game. :)

    A few very basic things it "does" get you.

    Entry in "some" tournaments and events that not just any organization can get into. Obviously there are dozens of events that will let anyone with the fees in also.
    That same organizations events can draw better teams and competition than some other organizations. So again, better competition for your player(s) when the org hosts its own events.
    Go to a tryout or team practice and see what talent it draws vs some other organizations.
    Go out and try to start a team with no name or lesser known organization and then compare doing the same thing with a well know organization and see the difference. You get better playing with other like players and talent. Not to mention experienced coaches, that can be in the eye of the beholder no matter where you go, but named organizations at least tend to draw better coaches or attempt to.

    Can you get your softball goals and dreams accomplished without a "name" organization? Most definitely. But having a few more open doors to help short cut the process a little is always good. Being at the right place, at the right time, with other very talented players and teams is always a good thing. Having coaches and team organizational leaders that beat on doors and have tons of contact with college coaches is a huge plus. You still have to do a very large portion of the work yourself as a family, the organization (and the coaches especially) just needs to be there to help put your kid in a position to be successful and seen, she still has to put in the work and have the talent to get it done.

    Better than being the best player on a bad team, in an organization that is not known, in venues that have no exposure, vs teams who also draw no exposure, offer little competition, keeps a few doors closed. Its a little common sense.

    Go to where the Beverly Bandits, Outlaws, Lasers, <fill in many other well known org names>, etc all hang out and you will most definitely see a different level of competition and talent vs where the DQ Darlings, Bob's Waterbed Emporium All-Stars, <fill in many org's I don't want to offend>, play.

    My two cents. :)
  11. wow

    wow Active Member

    I just said the same thing..
  12. init4all

    init4all New Member

    Do think some girls go there in high school because the job wasnt getting done else where?
  13. cobb_of_fury

    cobb_of_fury Member

    I was trying to make two points;
    - The Girls need to do the job them selves no matter where they are - Some organizations can help with this more than others and that is a great thing - But you cant just go to one of these organizations and expect a D1 scholarship.
    - It's easier for an organization to get girls into college when girls come to the organization already showing they have College potential - at that point you are acting more as a clearing house than a training ground.

    I never said there was anything wrong with the business model that "those" organization use - I just want it to be clear that the girls with college potential going to these organization gives the Organization gravitas as much as the organization name open doors- It is a reciprocal relationship, Not one sided.
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2017
  14. tjsmize3

    tjsmize3 Active Member

    To give a straight up answer to your question Cobb, and not to be a smart ass either, who really cares? Who cares about any of that stuff. In no conversation I have ever had with a TD or college coach is any of this even brought up. Who spends time thinking about that? Does a doctor need to know at 10u that he wants to go to med school and then stay the course or else? Does a Christian make the church or does the church make the Christian?

    95% of player development in the highest level players comes from what the parents have done on a daily basis with the player at home. Just as important are parents who have sought out competent professional instruction for their kids so that they aren't at home reinforcing bad habits.

    Upper level organizations generally call themselves that because they have a goal of putting together a team of girls who have set their sights on playing softball at the highest level. The org itself can do little more than find ways to offer opportunity. Opportunity to team up with top-level players, compete against top-level players, play in high-level tournaments, and be more marketable to high-level college programs. Those goals and advantages that an org can offer to players (and parents) usually remains a constant.

    Top level players, on the other hand, vary tremendously in their talent level and goals over their pre-college years. For instance, some players start out as a stud at 10u and find other priorities by 14u (good or bad). Some players start out as "rec-talented" players at 10u who decide at 14-16u they want to commit to playing at the highest level (my oldest daughter). Few players start out as studs and stay that way through college... although we know it happens that way for some.

    Since it is the nature of young women (and young men as well) to periodically reevaluate their goals and priorities, why is it surprising that high-level orgs will have substantial turnover. Who flippin' cares?

    In terms of my organization, it is most definitely MADE BY THE GIRLS and their families! It is a reflection of players and parents who at this point in their lives want the advantages we can offer them. I'm just lucky that every once in a while they allow me to drive the ship!
  15. DoubleTheFun

    DoubleTheFun Member

    I agree Cobb. It is a reciprocal relationship. Good players whether suited for collegiate play at D1, D2, D3, NAIA, or the JUCO level attract other good players and it is the coaches job (among other things) to make the roster selections to further the team and organization goals. Rarely do you see a player who is with a single organization from 10u-18u but sometimes that happens. Most often it is a matter of finding a match between a team's needs and a player's goals, where it is mutually beneficial for at least one year and maybe more. While the player and supporting families do the majority of the work, the organization name and more importantly the organization's recruiting coordinator can open a lot of doors. I am not surprised to see players gravitate toward some of the more recognizable org. names during the prime recruiting years, especially if it is the first time for a family going thru the recruiting process. I can admit to being absolutely clueless when our first daughter was in 12u and an org. director starting talking about what we perceived at the time as the distant future. At that point we realized we needed to learn everything we could from all possible sources. Our daughter happened to be with a lesser named org when she was recruited at 15u. She made a choice based upon which girls she wanted to play with. However we are eternally grateful for all that we learned from every org. she played with along the way. We realized you usually get what you give in any the organization choices.
  16. coachtomv

    coachtomv Active Member

    There you go. Well said.

    On a personal level, my kid and our family are where we are because its an atmosphere that pushes her and fully supports her as well. She may not decide to play college ball, she is a freshman and has not committed to the process fully, but she knows she loves the competition. The organization did not "make" her, (been there every year but 1 since 10u), but it has most definitely made her better. Just from the contacts, players, coaches, opponents, outside instructors they pointed us to from 10u, etc. It has also made me a better coach and I would not trade all the ups and downs along the way to get here. I also know that not all organizations, no matter how well meaning, can deliver on all the points that we as a family were/are looking for. None are perfect either, including ours, it is what you make it in a lot of ways.

    Do you think the Raiders "made" Derek Carr or did they make him better along with high level competition in practices and opponents? What if we went to the CFL or AFL? Would those orgs make him or make him better?

    Who really care's? It takes a village, same for athletes.

    In our case the "name" has gotten us what we are looking for so far. We like to think we have helped the name grow in our own little bit as well. When we started it was just getting going and we have seen it grow so fast and do so much. Some set backs to keep moving foreword, 1 step back 2 steps foreword, etc.

    One thing about the question of this thread, what about "What does a team name keep you from achieving?". Does a team name remove obstacles or create them? When an opportunity presents itself did the team name help you to/through the process or hold you back? Hmm.
  17. lewam3

    lewam3 Active Member

    Well, make sure DD develops into a player that no organization can resist and at that point you wont have to worry what an organization "can do for you". Attend a few combines, camps, have DD shine, and use that organization and team to get DD in front of the coaches that want to see her. You are using the organization, the organization is using your DD. Even-steven, right. NOW...On the other hand... if your DD hasn't the talent, then it's a one way street and the organization is simply using DD to fill a roster spot and get $$ from you. You as a parent should take the goggles off and make an honest assessment if you are worried about what an organization is doing for your daughter...If she lacks the talent, but loves playing by all means, let her continue playing, but please... don't blame the organization...
    On the other hand, if she has the talent...
    Mantra: Combine. Camps. Showcase. Email.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2017
  18. mike_dyer

    mike_dyer Member

    I can tell you for sure that the coaches from one of those schools don't even know that one of their recruits quit pitching 5 years ago.

    Having a conversation with them, any of them, would be like having a conversation with the table your
    laptop is sitting on.

    Anything else??

    Hey, keep paying that outLOLs team fee.

    Everyone needs to eat, right??
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2017
  19. mike_dyer

    mike_dyer Member

    I bet you didn't think "big boned" was an actual thing until you saw the skeleton tattoos on,,,,, certain people's legs...

    You believe it now, though.

    Because that's how dear leader pays their bills...
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2017
  20. mike_dyer

    mike_dyer Member

    Gotta tell you another story. I think you will like it.

    You may not believe it. I don't care though. It's 100% true.

    I sent my kid to a camp at a certain MAC school that I won't name at this time. I sent her there because a coach of hers played for the coach there.

    She had a certain coach who posts here giving instruction at the camp. He or she was actually, somehow, named "coach of the year" in his or her conference. Which leads me to believe that a quadruple amputee, a severe burn victim, or maybe even a dead body could be successful at coaching college softball.


    This person told and then showed my kid and all of the other kids at the camp that the best way to field a ball hit hard to you at 2nd base was to kick it like a soccer ball to 1st base.

    This "coach" also showed them some dip **** behind the back flip thing that might work in baseball if you were competing against the Angeline School of Opportunity co-ed team on a day when they hadn't warmed up.

    On my way home from the camp my bank called me and told me that a student at the school found my check laying in some bushes on campus. I called the kid who found it and told them to send it back to me.

    She got nothing out of it. We ended up paying nothing for it.

    Things have a funny way of working themeselves out.

    HITTER23 likes this.

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