New USA age cut off for next season?

[OhioKymn]

I am hoping someone will say that I am misunderstanding this, or missing something.
The USA council in November approved new birthdate regulations for the age divisions in youth softball, as i read it:
Age on August 31st will be the new regulation at the end of this season (for the fall 2023- summer 2024 season.)
As an example: Girls in 10u for the first time this year, born Jan-August 2013, will move to 12u the next season, losing a yr of 10u, but also splitting up a team of girls.
Please tell me I am missing something.
And for you insiders: will USSSA and other sanctioning bodies switch to this new age cut off, too?

 

[Stedman00]

it is confusing.

10U. as long as they have not turned 11 from jan 2023 to Aug 31, 2023, they would play 10 u next league year that starts 1 Sept 2023. That would also, apply to players that turn 11 in say November 2023......Were they 11 as of 31 Aug??? NOPE. therefore 10U for 23-24 season that starts 1 Sept.

now if they are 10 right now, and turn 11 in say may of 2023, yes, they go to 12u on September 1st.

But nothing says that the player that turns 11 in November cannot play up into 12u as well, keeping them all together

Basically what it has done is A) force teams to play up that were 'riding' the lower age brackets in the fall. Most were already moving up, but there were some. B) more closely aligns age brackets to grades in school.

 

[IRdad09]

It is confusing for sure. The easiest way to think of this is Aug 31 is the new Dec 31. Yes, there are bound to be teams that need to adjust and in theory some players will be able to take advantage of "another year" in whatever age bracket they have been in. My guess will be all in all for established teams and players this won't make much of a difference.

 

[Captain_Thunder]

I am hoping someone will say that I am misunderstanding this, or missing something.
The USA council in November approved new birthdate regulations for the age divisions in youth softball, as i read it:
Age on August 31st will be the new regulation at the end of this season (for the fall 2023- summer 2024 season.)
As an example: Girls in 10u for the first time this year, born Jan-August 2013, will move to 12u the next season, losing a yr of 10u, but also splitting up a team of girls.
Please tell me I am missing something.
And for you insiders: will USSSA and other sanctioning bodies switch to this new age cut off, too?

Any girl born in the time frame you are referring to - January - August 2023 - will be turning 10 over these next several months. They will all be 10U next year too!

This is to put birth years in line with Grad years. Def going to be some bumps at beginning, but I'd bet everyone will eventually use this range. Make Showcases easier...

 

[SonicMojo]

Good in theory, but then you also have 20%+ of age eligible kids redshirting kindergarten every year.

 

[Captain_Thunder]

Good in theory, but then you also have 20%+ of age eligible kids redshirting kindergarten every year.

you can't please everybody! LOL But for those following the actual guidelines - it works the best!

 

[daboss]

Changing the age deadline is relative in nature. We don't like any change from what we perceive to be the normal. This is not the first time an age deadline has changed. Once things cycle thru their course it'll be the new normal. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Little League has always been different from the other sanctions. Bottom line; I liked the Dec. 31 simply because it was easy for me to remember and parents at the time appeared to be more comfortable with it-----more accepting. I guess I understand why the change due to the popularity of fall ball, something that has caught fire over recent years. I'm glad the girls have choices and get to play the game more if they want. I assume the deadline change is due to the fall ball activity. Oh well, we'll live thru it.....

 

[Stedman00]

the increase of playing fall ball, has also lead to people playing down in the fall, before playing up in the spring. Some label this as "trophy chasing", and some other things. Most have always aged up as of August 1st, and took their lumps if warranted in the fall, learned and improved over winter for summer season.

This does put the ages more in line with school grades ie 2 girls both in say 9th grade, 1 born in Nov 2000, 1 in following January 2001 , under old rules, would be in different age years

 

[Tommy Evans]

This just stole a year of softball for girls born before the date change. If they wanted to make a change it should have just been for girls starting in 2024.

 

[Captain_Thunder]

This just stole a year of softball for girls born before the date change. If they wanted to make a change it should have just been for girls starting in 2024.

Not sure who your math teacher was, but according to mine - it gives girls born in September, October, November, & December an extra year in the current age division they are now in! And girls born during those months in 2004 now get to play an additional 18U year!
Nothing stolen, only given, like Robin Hood!

 

[OhioKymn]

Thanks so much for the insight on this everyone. This is what I have put together:
for 2024 Summer (beginning in fall of 2023)
10u will still be (can still be) all girls born in 2013 and 2014, as expected. The bonus is that the late birthday 2012 players can play 10u too.
[and the late birthday 2014 have the option of staying in 8u another year, if they choose to]
12u will be (can be) girls born in 2011 and 2012, as expected. The bonus of some late birthday 2010 players playing in 12u, too.
[and the late birthday 2012 have the option of staying in 10u another year, if they choose]
14u will be 2009 & 2010, as expected, with bonus late year 2008 also able to play
[late birthday 2010 may choose to stay in 12u for another year]

So straight birth year teams do not have to split up. Only if a late birthday player chooses to stay down another year. Otherwise, teams can stay together and play as they have been.
Do I have it correct now?

 

[Tommy Evans]

Not sure who your math teacher was, but according to mine - it gives girls born in September, October, November, & December an extra year in the current age division they are now in! And girls born during those months in 2004 now get to play an additional 18U year!
Nothing stolen, only given, like Robin Hood!

Ahh yes I misunderstood it. Thanks for explaining it.

 

[steve77621]

This is only for USA sanctioned tournaments correct?

 

[yocoach]

This is only for USA sanctioned tournaments, correct?

Right now, yes. However, USSSA has been talking about doing this very same thing for years so expect it to happen next year ( if not sooner ) for them since they need to keep up with the "Jones." Then you'll probably see the rest follow shortly after. I'm thinking PGF will be the next. If I remember correctly, NSA floated this a little while ago and went this route recently. I could be wrong though.

Once USA, USSSA, NSA and PGF go to those dates, I can see TCS and the others doing the same simply because a majority of the teams that play those events will already be aligned with the new age dates and it would just be silly to try and fight it..

 

[Mike_Craig_-_Ohio USSSA]

Right now, yes. However, USSSA has been talking about doing this very same thing for years so expect it to happen next year ( if not sooner ) for them since they need to keep up with the "Jones." Then you'll probably see the rest follow shortly after. I'm thinking PGF will be the next. If I remember correctly, NSA floated this a little while ago and went this route recently. I could be wrong though.

Once USA, USSSA, NSA and PGF go to those dates, I can see TCS and the others doing the same simply because a majority of the teams that play those events will already be aligned with the new age dates and it would just be silly to try and fight it..

USSSA hasn't been talking about doing this for years. In fact, this wasn't even a topic of discussion at our national meeting back in November and hasn't been in previous meetings. USA Softball didn't even make this public until after their meeting which is literally ending when ours begins so unless a vendor from that meeting had info to share, we didn't have anything on this when we met.

Now that doesn't mean since this has now been common knowledge for a few months, that our higher-ups are not aware of this and soliciting feedback from state and regional directors. For us to pull it off would need that our IT team at the National office is able to make this change since this moves up the age cutoff date from 12/31 to 8/31. Baseball already is on a 4/30 age cutoff date in our system anyway, so probably not a tough fix but our IT team has been busy with a new website roll out since before the meeting this fall.

Not a "keeping up with the Jones" move if it makes sense. I would say unless it is a no-brainer, look for us to not make a decision on this until our National meeting in November, plus by that time we would already be in the 2024 season so if a move is made on our end, it will affect the 2025 season. We already run our fall events that start up in September on a 12/31 cutoff anyway so there is no staying down in the fall season on our end anyway. It usually has always been the non-sanctioned events where this occurred in the fall as you have to put birthyears in our roster system and it will stop someone from putting on a kid who is "aged" out just for the fall season. In essence, on Sept 1 it is the same as New Years Day for our program with new age groups.

 

[yocoach]

USSSA hasn't been talking about doing this for years. In fact, this wasn't even a topic of discussion at our national meeting back in November and hasn't been in previous meetings. USA Softball didn't even make this public until after their meeting which is literally ending when ours begins so unless a vendor from that meeting had info to share, we didn't have anything on this when we met.

Now that doesn't mean since this has now been common knowledge for a few months, that our higher-ups are not aware of this and soliciting feedback from state and regional directors. For us to pull it off would need that our IT team at the National office is able to make this change since this moves up the age cutoff date from 12/31 to 8/31. Baseball already is on a 4/30 age cutoff date in our system anyway, so probably not a tough fix but our IT team has been busy with a new website roll out since before the meeting this fall.

Not a "keeping up with the Jones" move if it makes sense. I would say unless it is a no-brainer, look for us to not make a decision on this until our National meeting in November, plus by that time we would already be in the 2024 season so if a move is made on our end, it will affect the 2025 season. We already run our fall events that start up in September on a 12/31 cutoff anyway so there is no staying down in the fall season on our end anyway. It usually has always been the non-sanctioned events where this occurred in the fall as you have to put birthyears in our roster system and it will stop someone from putting on a kid who is "aged" out just for the fall season. In essence, on Sept 1 it is the same as New Years Day for our program with new age groups.

Thanks for the clarification. I was just repeating what was told to me by a gentleman from Florida that claimed he was part of USSSA. Maybe he was talking about the state or local and I misunderstood.

 

[Mike_Craig_-_Ohio USSSA]

So getting back to this topic since I have had about 5-8 calls/e-mails on the subject this past week. Someone with a more clear head (mine is kicking into season mode so very day-to-day right now) "sell" me on the pros and cons with this type of date change?

I understand what it does to try to align with grad years for high school ages but what about the whole as the travel softball world does not revolve around strictly showcase events, although some people think that is all it is for from past thinking.

 

[Stedman00]

only bennie I can come up with, is that it more closely aligns school years with age brackets.

 

[DanMaz]

the increase of playing fall ball, has also lead to people playing down in the fall, before playing up in the spring. Some label this as "trophy chasing", and some other things. Most have always aged up as of August 1st, and took their lumps if warranted in the fall, learned and improved over winter for summer season.

This does put the ages more in line with school grades ie 2 girls both in say 9th grade, 1 born in Nov 2000, 1 in following January 2001 , under old rules, would be in different age years

once its August, in our eyes you go to next age group. example: 2nd year 10u that just finished in August or July should be playing 11u after August. I don't recall us or many teams playing down (staying in 10u tourneys) all fall and then go up to 11u after Jan. 1st... some do that now? why?

 

[Stedman00]

yes, there are teams around that would 'ride' the lower age in fall, before officially moving up in age in spring. some call it Trophy chasing.

What it does is bring girls that are in the same grade into the same age groups. Example. my DD has Feb '01 birth date, and she played school ball with several other girls that were born in ~Nov 2000. the girls that were only 2 months older, played a whole year ahead in travel ball. IE 14u versus 12u, 16 vs 14u, etc. That's what i believe they are trying to fix.