default
Member
What is a good throw down time for a catcher from the time it hits her glove to 2nd base glove.
default
Member
It depends on how old the player is and how storng a arm she has. 
default
Member
This stat is most commonly called "pop to pop time" or "pop time" (and also is referred to as "catcher's release time". ?I believe that anything under 2 seconds would catch the eye of some college coach; I think, but am not certain, that 1.7 is in the Division I range.
Here's an interesting piece from a baseball site (http://www.baseballfactory.com/downloads/news/10-15/101502-3.html) making the point that pop time shouldn't be viewed in a vacuum (again, remember the author is talking about baseball, but many of the general points transfer over to fastpitch):
"4. The ability to throw out base stealers: Too many times this is looked at as the main measure of a catcher's ability. It certainly is valuable to have a catcher that can slow down the running game of the opposing team, but I still believe the items listed above are more important. Ideally the catcher throws out the runners he is supposed to throw out - not the guys that make a career of stealing bases, but the guys that try and steal the base to take the double play out of order or to get into scoring position. Please see some important terms below:
a. Steal Time: the amount of time it takes for the runner (with a lead off of 1B) from his first movement to get to the 2B bag. We would like to throw out the runners with Steal Times of around 3.5 seconds, the top base stealers have Steal Times of around 3.3 seconds.
b. Pitcher's Release Time: the amount of time it takes for the pitcher in the stretch from his first movement (that the base stealer would react to) until the ball reaches the catcher's glove. Pitchers are generally expected to have release times of less than 1.4 seconds, and in some cases closer to 1.2 seconds.
c. Catcher's Release Time: the amount of time it takes for the ball to get from the catcher's glove (pop of the mitt) to the infielder's glove (pop of the mitt) covering 2B on a throw from home plate to 2B. This is often refered to as a a "pop- to-pop" time.
I am often asked about the ideal release time (or pop time) for a catcher. Most people would expect to hear an answer such as 1.85 seconds, or anything under 2.0 seconds. In reality the ideal Release Time for a catcher is based on the Pitcher's Release Time and the runner's Steal Time - and in most cases the answer ends up being around 2.1 seconds on the bag. If the throw is off line it will take more time for the catch and tag. I do not want to downplay the ability to catch and throw, because it is highly sought after in catchers. I only want to make clear what it takes at minimum to throw out a good number of runners - remember throwing out 25% of base stealers is good.
EXAMPLE: The pitcher's release time (1.4 seconds) is subtracted from the Runner's Steal Time (3.5 seconds), this leaves 2.1 seconds for the catcher's throw to 2B and for the tag to be applied?therefore, an accurate throw with a release time of 2.1 seconds will throw out a runner with a 3.5 second steal time (above average for the high school level, about average for the college level) as long as the pitcher gets the ball to the plate in under 1.4 seconds (slightly above average for the high school level, about average for the college level). "
. ?I believe that anything under 2 seconds would catch the eye of some college coach; I think, but am not certain, that 1.7 is in the Division I range.Here's an interesting piece from a baseball site (http://www.baseballfactory.com/downloads/news/10-15/101502-3.html) making the point that pop time shouldn't be viewed in a vacuum (again, remember the author is talking about baseball, but many of the general points transfer over to fastpitch):
"4. The ability to throw out base stealers: Too many times this is looked at as the main measure of a catcher's ability. It certainly is valuable to have a catcher that can slow down the running game of the opposing team, but I still believe the items listed above are more important. Ideally the catcher throws out the runners he is supposed to throw out - not the guys that make a career of stealing bases, but the guys that try and steal the base to take the double play out of order or to get into scoring position. Please see some important terms below:
a. Steal Time: the amount of time it takes for the runner (with a lead off of 1B) from his first movement to get to the 2B bag. We would like to throw out the runners with Steal Times of around 3.5 seconds, the top base stealers have Steal Times of around 3.3 seconds.
b. Pitcher's Release Time: the amount of time it takes for the pitcher in the stretch from his first movement (that the base stealer would react to) until the ball reaches the catcher's glove. Pitchers are generally expected to have release times of less than 1.4 seconds, and in some cases closer to 1.2 seconds.
c. Catcher's Release Time: the amount of time it takes for the ball to get from the catcher's glove (pop of the mitt) to the infielder's glove (pop of the mitt) covering 2B on a throw from home plate to 2B. This is often refered to as a a "pop- to-pop" time.
I am often asked about the ideal release time (or pop time) for a catcher. Most people would expect to hear an answer such as 1.85 seconds, or anything under 2.0 seconds. In reality the ideal Release Time for a catcher is based on the Pitcher's Release Time and the runner's Steal Time - and in most cases the answer ends up being around 2.1 seconds on the bag. If the throw is off line it will take more time for the catch and tag. I do not want to downplay the ability to catch and throw, because it is highly sought after in catchers. I only want to make clear what it takes at minimum to throw out a good number of runners - remember throwing out 25% of base stealers is good.
EXAMPLE: The pitcher's release time (1.4 seconds) is subtracted from the Runner's Steal Time (3.5 seconds), this leaves 2.1 seconds for the catcher's throw to 2B and for the tag to be applied?therefore, an accurate throw with a release time of 2.1 seconds will throw out a runner with a 3.5 second steal time (above average for the high school level, about average for the college level) as long as the pitcher gets the ball to the plate in under 1.4 seconds (slightly above average for the high school level, about average for the college level). "
default
Member
well said cgs!!
default
Member
Every pitchers' release time in softball is the same
The only variable is the time it takes the ball to travel from her hand to the catcher's glove -- the variation is literally thousandths of a second (difference between 59 mph and 57 mph, etc), which makes it basically inconsequential
there might be any truer measure in softball than catcher's pop time -- 1.8 is what the big-time college softball coaches look for
Relative to baseball, the most amazing thing in softball is the catcher's throw distance NEVER changes -- at 9 she's throwing 84-6, at 22 she's throwing 84-6.
The only variable is the time it takes the ball to travel from her hand to the catcher's glove -- the variation is literally thousandths of a second (difference between 59 mph and 57 mph, etc), which makes it basically inconsequential
there might be any truer measure in softball than catcher's pop time -- 1.8 is what the big-time college softball coaches look for
Relative to baseball, the most amazing thing in softball is the catcher's throw distance NEVER changes -- at 9 she's throwing 84-6, at 22 she's throwing 84-6.
default
Member
So how is 2.16 for a 14 yr old? obviously she can always work to get better, but accuracy comes into play as well wouldn't you think?
default
Member
H-Dad,
Very Good....
Ron Poole
Very Good....
Ron Poole
default
Member
We had a pair of catchers last year which throw out 85% of ALL runners (1st to 2nd, 2nd to 3rd) had no delayed steals and throw out an average of one runner a game at first base. In addition between them they didn't have more than 5 throwing errors in over 60 games. ?They were a joy to watch One is all conference and the other who is 5' 11" is playing first base for her high school team, why is the question? ?No question great catching will kept you in the game.
One is all conference and the other who is 5' 11" is playing first base for her high school team, why is the question? ?No question great catching will kept you in the game.
default
Member
Rebel,
Here are the results from this past summer's NFCA Recruitment camp held in Toledo.
They are comparable to the times from Colorado and points west, just for the record.
The participants were 15-18yr olds.
http://www.nfca.org/pagebank/?id=576
Here are the results from this past summer's NFCA Recruitment camp held in Toledo.
They are comparable to the times from Colorado and points west, just for the record.
The participants were 15-18yr olds.
http://www.nfca.org/pagebank/?id=576
default
Member
IMHO
It?s a big miss conception to think that you need to increase throwing velocity. Velocity and throwing technique are important as well, but these are things you learn from the basics and hopefully someone is steering you in the right direction. First, I always preach to girls I work with; get the ball out of your glove as soon as possible. Second is teaching instincts or reading the base runners, without good instincts catching may not be for you, you may want to become a PITCHER HAHAHA! If you?re going to measure pop time the only place to be accurate is during a game, that?s where muscle memory takes over and your true time is revealed. I?ve been to most of these camps where they measure pop times. In most cases the girls are cheating. Dropping their throwing foot back, coming out of their stance before the ball gets to them, things like that. Sure it?s easy to have a great pop time when you cheat the system.
Just some thoughts
Doug
It?s a big miss conception to think that you need to increase throwing velocity. Velocity and throwing technique are important as well, but these are things you learn from the basics and hopefully someone is steering you in the right direction. First, I always preach to girls I work with; get the ball out of your glove as soon as possible. Second is teaching instincts or reading the base runners, without good instincts catching may not be for you, you may want to become a PITCHER HAHAHA! If you?re going to measure pop time the only place to be accurate is during a game, that?s where muscle memory takes over and your true time is revealed. I?ve been to most of these camps where they measure pop times. In most cases the girls are cheating. Dropping their throwing foot back, coming out of their stance before the ball gets to them, things like that. Sure it?s easy to have a great pop time when you cheat the system.
Just some thoughts
Doug
default
Member
Absolutley right Doug. We were in the same boat last year. Went to a camp where a kid was clocking 1.75 pop time, but she couldn`t have blocked a basketball as bad as she was turned. The other thing was girls reaching out to grab the ball. Some lunged so bad their helmet may have caused interference let alone their glove.
I could only tell my kid that a college coach worth their salt should be able to see through these things and see who is mechanically sound and who isn`t.
I could only tell my kid that a college coach worth their salt should be able to see through these things and see who is mechanically sound and who isn`t.
default
Member
So true 99, I have had many people think that it's as easy as just throwing equipment and glove on and go stop the ball. There is so much more for the girls to know and do it isn't even funny. Anything from blocking properly, calling pitches, plays, communication on what base to go to during bunts, backing up plays, tracking foul balls that they can get too, past balls, etc and the overall mental toughness of catching 4-5 games on a 95 degree day with all the gear on.
Throw time is only one component of a much bigger package!
Throw time is only one component of a much bigger package!
