JV and college aspirations

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I know a girl who got very little if any time at the mound pitching in high school and ended up pitching in college and for the Akron Racers. Don't sweat it.

 

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I have found the biggest issue is change.

If a new coach comes in and starts pullng up girls up and the former never did.....issues and the reverse is the same.

And believe it or not. Unless you are winning States, winning does not seem to matter one bit. At least that is my experience. Now if you win States. The coach has serious control. And they no longer have to play nice (at least for a year or 2). But go 2 years of not being nice and not winning..........and it gets ugly. I have seen it all. And my girls are just heading into HS.

 

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Daughter is playing freshman ball this year...she obviously wanted to play up, dissappointed, but not crushed with what team she is playing on, still wants to play in college, still looks forward to playing with her select team this summer, still likes to harrass me about my hair turning grey....yep, success in hers!

 

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Sammy and Spartansd

I guess I just look at things a bit differently. If I were a HS coach I would pick the kids who I feel gives me the best opportunity to win. If that means playing a freshman or sophmore over a senior then so be it. I also believe politics has no place in sports. In all honesty, I don't understand where parents get off thinking they can question the coach about what team their kid is on and what position their kid plays for the school.

My older dd is a junior and plays volleyball for her HS. There were quite a few juniors that played JV and did not sit for Varsity. At the end of the season, the coach had a meeting with each player individually. Many juniors were told that if they tried out for their senior year, she will not cut them and they will make Varsity, but at their current talent level chances are that they will never see any play time. Sure, it sounds harsh but at least she was being honest with them and they know where they stand. This coach plays the players she feels gives her team the best chance to win. This coach is honest with the parents. There are kids and parents that do not like her. I've seen her upset after talking with a parent or a player but she never wavers from her stance, and I respect her for that. I went to many games and watched all three teams compete, and she was right and the disgruntled parents and players were wrong. She had the kids on the correct teams. There are kids that are freshman and sophmores on the freshman and JV teams that will probably play volleyball at the next level. In the end, things work out when a coach is honest with their players and play the players that give them the best chance to win.

Len

 

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A different sport (Mens Basketball), but here is an example of the greatest player in Basktball history (Michael Jordan) who didn't make his varsity team as a Freshman or Sophmore. If a kid has the talent and the drive to play at the next level it will happen.

 

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A different sport (Mens Basketball), but here is an example of the greatest player in Basktball history (Michael Jordan) who didn't make his varsity team as a Freshman or Sophmore. If a kid has the talent and the drive to play at the next level it will happen.

Who was the only person able to hold Jordan to under 18 points per game??


Dean Smith........

Len

 

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Who was the only person able to hold Jordan to under 18 points per game??


Dean Smith........

Len

Didn't IU's Dan Dachich (sp) shut MJ down in NCAA tourney.

 

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Didn't IU's Dan Dachich (sp) shut MJ down in NCAA tourney.

He might not have been the only one but the Dean Smith (Jordan's coach at UNC) thing was a joke in the 80's during Jordan's first run with the Bulls.

Len

 

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Sammy and Spartansd

I guess I just look at things a bit differently. If I were a HS coach I would pick the kids who I feel gives me the best opportunity to win. If that means playing a freshman or sophmore over a senior then so be it. I also believe politics has no place in sports. In all honesty, I don't understand where parents get off thinking they can question the coach about what team their kid is on and what position their kid plays for the school.

My older dd is a junior and plays volleyball for her HS. There were quite a few juniors that played JV and did not sit for Varsity. At the end of the season, the coach had a meeting with each player individually. Many juniors were told that if they tried out for their senior year, she will not cut them and they will make Varsity, but at their current talent level chances are that they will never see any play time. Sure, it sounds harsh but at least she was being honest with them and they know where they stand. This coach plays the players she feels gives her team the best chance to win. This coach is honest with the parents. There are kids and parents that do not like her. I've seen her upset after talking with a parent or a player but she never wavers from her stance, and I respect her for that. I went to many games and watched all three teams compete, and she was right and the disgruntled parents and players were wrong. She had the kids on the correct teams. There are kids that are freshman and sophmores on the freshman and JV teams that will probably play volleyball at the next level. In the end, things work out when a coach is honest with their players and play the players that give them the best chance to win.

Len

Len, we agree on more than you think. In a perfect world, the competent HS coach would just put every kid on the team that: 1) gives the varsity the best chance to win 2) provides development of underclassmen 3) Best suits the current talent level of the athlete.

However, it's NOT a perfect world, and just like balancing a state budget, there are always hidden agendas. As long as parents have a different opinion (often distorted) of their kid's abilities, there will be some degree of friction with the coach. Trying to convince the HS coach that they are running their program incorrectly is a slippery slope. After your kid goes through the high school program, you may not change your opinions of how and why the coach does things, but one thing became clear to me: It ain't worth the hassle of making life miserable for my DD and everyone around me trying to change something that has a 99% probability of failure.

College is the same way, and I found it prudent to adopt a similar mentality there. Steer clear of the what, how and whys of the coach running their program - and just support DD in her efforts. I found that being a good listener to my DD and only offering suggestions about softball things when asked worked quite well.

 

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College is the same way, and I found it prudent to adopt a similar mentality there. Steer clear of the what, how and whys of the coach running their program - and just support DD in her efforts. I found that being a good listener to my DD and only offering suggestions about softball things when asked worked quite well.

Good advice. As a college coach, I am as interested in a parent's advice in how we run our program as they would be in my advice on how they do their job.

 

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Good advice. As a college coach, I am as interested in a parent's advice in how we run our program as they would be in my advice on how they do their job.

Exactly Joe. That's an excellent way to put it in perspective. I think parents have the notion that just because their kids are involved they have some degree of say in how the program is ran. I've even heard stories of that spilling over into their kid's college life. That can turn into a sad situation indeed.

As my DD got older and advanced to the college level, I considered her college softball her career of sorts. She obviously knows more about women's college softball than I, just as I know more about MY job than she does. She never gave me unrequested advice about my job, so why would it be any different for hers? Actually, when I DO have a specific question about softball, I value her advice as I know it's the voice of experience.

 

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Sammy and Spartansd

I guess I just look at things a bit differently. If I were a HS coach I would pick the kids who I feel gives me the best opportunity to win. If that means playing a freshman or sophmore over a senior then so be it. I also believe politics has no place in sports. In all honesty, I don't understand where parents get off thinking they can question the coach about what team their kid is on and what position their kid plays for the school.

My older dd is a junior and plays volleyball for her HS. There were quite a few juniors that played JV and did not sit for Varsity. At the end of the season, the coach had a meeting with each player individually. Many juniors were told that if they tried out for their senior year, she will not cut them and they will make Varsity, but at their current talent level chances are that they will never see any play time. Sure, it sounds harsh but at least she was being honest with them and they know where they stand. This coach plays the players she feels gives her team the best chance to win. This coach is honest with the parents. There are kids and parents that do not like her. I've seen her upset after talking with a parent or a player but she never wavers from her stance, and I respect her for that. I went to many games and watched all three teams compete, and she was right and the disgruntled parents and players were wrong. She had the kids on the correct teams. There are kids that are freshman and sophmores on the freshman and JV teams that will probably play volleyball at the next level. In the end, things work out when a coach is honest with their players and play the players that give them the best chance to win.

Len

I think you may not be understanding what I was saying.

I do not think any of the girls that were on JV should have been on the Varsity. They were where they needed to be. And the girl who was told she would not pitch on Varsity........she would not have, but she worked her arse off the next 9 months and became a top level player.

I guess my point is that hard work is what separates the girls.

And I totally agree that the coaches job at the varsity level is to win games. And sometimes that will not include the gifts our daughters bring to the game.

 

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Unfortunately, as I read along throughout this post, it disgusts me more and more that parents are more concerned about their own egos instead of their daughters. I can't believe that a parent would want to goto a varsity game to watch their kid sit the bench. That has to be alot of fun, I guess it fulfills some parents mentally to know that they get to sit in the stands, regardless if their kid plays at all that day, just so they can say, "My DD made Varsity her Freshman year". Those same parents that will sit there and all they have to hope for is that the team gets a huge lead or someone gets hurt, so their kid gets a chance to play. Wow, this sounds pretty competitive to me, get real. Throughout my experiences over the years as a player and a parent, sitting the bench stinks. Face it, if you are on the bench, it means you are not good enough to start over the next player. That's why Terrell Owens even with his attitude, doesn't sit the bench, and all the other players we sit and watch year after year. People are concerned more these days about their kid's getting a sport's scholarship, are you for real, they are freshman. They are kids, they might quit playing, find a boyfriend, who knows. As a parent of a daughter that plays high school and travel ball, I go to the games to watch my kid play, not to hope that she does. I hope to have the money to send my daughter to college when that day arrives, if there is any help with scholarship, God Bless! One last note, to all the coaches out there, throw change-ups to all of these kids in travel ball, sounds like they can't adjust.

 

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@HBTCB My dd's goal is to play in college. I support that goal just as I would if she decided to play trombone in college. She was down about making jv as a freshman thinking her chances for playing college ball were through. I believed that they weren't but I thought I would ask others who had gone through the process for their comments and thoughts.

I too would rather have her play at JV than sit for varsity games. Not sure where you came up with the ego thing.

 

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Unfortunately, as I read along throughout this post, it disgusts me more and more that parents are more concerned about their own egos instead of their daughters. I can't believe that a parent would want to goto a varsity game to watch their kid sit the bench. That has to be alot of fun, I guess it fulfills some parents mentally to know that they get to sit in the stands, regardless if their kid plays at all that day, just so they can say, "My DD made Varsity her Freshman year". Those same parents that will sit there and all they have to hope for is that the team gets a huge lead or someone gets hurt, so their kid gets a chance to play. Wow, this sounds pretty competitive to me, get real. Throughout my experiences over the years as a player and a parent, sitting the bench stinks. Face it, if you are on the bench, it means you are not good enough to start over the next player. That's why Terrell Owens even with his attitude, doesn't sit the bench, and all the other players we sit and watch year after year. People are concerned more these days about their kid's getting a sport's scholarship, are you for real, they are freshman. They are kids, they might quit playing, find a boyfriend, who knows. As a parent of a daughter that plays high school and travel ball, I go to the games to watch my kid play, not to hope that she does. I hope to have the money to send my daughter to college when that day arrives, if there is any help with scholarship, God Bless! One last note, to all the coaches out there, throw change-ups to all of these kids in travel ball, sounds like they can't adjust.

I think we may be reading different threads. Nowhere on this one did I see that any parent would rather their kid sit Varsity over playing JV.

 

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Somewhere in the last few weeks, I said that I'd rather have my kid sit on varsity than play JV, but I am clearly in the minority on that. My position is based upon the inferior JV competition in our neck of the woods and on my knowledge of the competency of the JV coaches when my DD was playing HS. Others reasonably think that a player can maintain her skills while playing down from her level of travel ball, but given everything else on a player's plate in her freshman year (and given the pretty depressing responses at Bustos clinics when Crystl asks whether the players practice on their own), I'd still opt for sitting on varsity as long as my kid was on board with that. But my approach hasn't got much to do with parental ego; it is based on what I think is best for a developing player who has aspirations to play in college. Whether a player makes varsity their freshman year isn't going to have a significant effect on whether they play in college, so in and of itself, that's pretty much a non-factor if college is the goal. But if the player has a relatively long re-tooling period in the transition from HS to travel ball it could mean that she's playing in front of college coaches without having regained her "A" game.

And as I said, most people disagree with me on the question whether it's better to have significantly reduced time on varsity than to play all the time on JV. A lot of that disagreement is based on the fact that they have good JV coaches and good competition from other schools. So I'm pretty much a straw horse on this one and I agree that HTPCB's claim that parents have exhibited "disgusting" egocentricity in this and other threads seems a little overblown and also reads a whole lot more into the opinion on JV vs Varsity than anyone has ever actually said in the recent threads.

Now on the upside, many of you appear to prefer the emotionally weighted and opinionated language of an HTPCB to the less freighted language of Artillary, another very recent poster. So things are balancing out.

 

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Carol ... you make great points and I am a little torn on this one. It definitely depends a lot I think on the quality of the coaching and competition. While I suppose some parents may get an ego boost saying their DD plays varsity, others may get it by bragging about how well their DD does in her JV games. I know several girls who played JV as a freshmen and who are playing college today, albeit at D2 and D3 levels. The D1 college coaches are going to be seeing these freshmen for themselves at their summer games (assuming they are truly good enough to play on top caliber travel teams), and I don't think these coaches are going to doubt their own assessments based on whether a high school coach placed them on varsity or JV.

 

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The D1 college coaches are going to be seeing these freshmen for themselves at their summer games (assuming they are truly good enough to play on top caliber travel teams), and I don't think these coaches are going to doubt their own assessments based on whether a high school coach placed them on varsity or JV.

Absolutely agree. My lingering doubt is whether the freshmen who played JV or Freshman ball will be able to present their best play during June and July. And that is a question about which reasonable people can agree to disagree.

And I stand by my other point that I'm not sure where HTPCB gets his or her conclusion that parents are disgustingly egocentric regarding this question. Most appear to take the position that they would rather have their DD play JV.

 

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Absolutely agree. My lingering doubt is whether the freshmen who played JV or Freshman ball will be able to present their best play during June and July. And that is a question about which reasonable people can agree to disagree.

And I stand by my other point that I'm not sure where HTPCB gets his or her conclusion that parents are disgustingly egocentric regarding this question. Most appear to take the position that they would rather have their DD play JV.

Hopefully my daughter will be at her A level for travel ball even having played JV. (Nothing to do with my ego, simply wanting my daughter to perform to her ability to achive HER GOAL) You do make several good points and I have seen JV programs that are less than stellar with poor instruction. I could see these programs harm a player's development/create bad habits.

 

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Another point for consideration is the position your DD plays during school ball. Mine was a pitcher, so my viewpoint was probably distorted - it didn't really matter about the batters abilities, she threw the same either way. Pitchers will get the workout regardless of the opponent's abilities. Although I'd have to say it's more fun if there's an occasional ball in play.

For position players, it could be a long season with little action, so I could see their focus waning somewhat. My DD's travel coaches also were also concerned about "skill fall-off" during high school season, but I didn't really worry about that too much. DD's pitching on jv was pretty dominant, largely because a large percentage of the kids on the opposing teams didn't play travel. Sure, there were the 12 - 15+ strikeout games, but the fielders still seemed to stay mentally in the game. Winning has it's benefits.