All Conference Question

How is it that they determine who gets first or second team or honorable mention? It seems to be a big secret on how or why and I was just wondering....

coaches vote on it - your team coach puts the names in and the other coaches vote on those players

it is a little mysterious I've been to the meetings and some negociating takes place. If a girl has been a good for 2-3 years they usually get the props they deserve, sometimes a 1 or 2 year player might get overlooked. It is sometimes based on numbers and we all know how crazy HS stats can be. A little good press on these boards can't hurt an athlete either.

sad but in some leagues it is all politics and the best player doesn't always get picked. :-/

I'd say it is definitely a popularity contest or who knows who situation...

Honorable mention in some leagues is picked by each High School coach. That is why you will see one player from each school.

Plateprincess, if you already knew the answer why did you ask the question?

No system is perfect and there aren't always enough spots for all the deserving players, but most of the girls that get these awards are deserving. Yes, their HS coaches have to nominate them and vote, etc. - so those girls that don't have their coaches support don't stand much of a chance. So make sure your HS coach is doing these things if your DD has the talent to be nominated.

sliderz - I agree in that most girls are deserving. ?But when a group of coaches who bunch together and say......i'll vote for your girl if you voted for mine...... it does stop the best girls from getting on. ?And in some instances it is the coach who wants the most girls so she/he can have more feathers in his/her cap.( ya know what I'm talking about. ?it somestimes hard to explain in text than in person). ?it's if the coach can say "well I got 4 of my girls on hurray for me ......even if there are better players for that position. ?

I know for a fact that this year in our league voting, the little "bunch" of coaches didn't even look at stats of other players they just voted for "their group". ? Sad but true. Even when the girl's coach was supporting and talking them up the "bunch " didn't listen and had put their vote in the ballot box even before the coach was finished. ?Stats and their play on the field didn't matter.

Plateprincess, if you already knew the answer why did you ask the question?

I didn't know the answer when I asked but based on all the personal mesages to me explaining what is really going on with these picks I now understand much better. ?I actually thought they were based on a player's performance, stats, leadership, hard work etc. which is why I asked. I could not understand how a team that is back to back league champs can have only one first team player. Makes much more sense now.

The players selected to all-conference type teams deserve to be there the vast majority of the time. ? The players with the best stats and/or who have meant the most to their team are the ones nominated by the teams coach. ? Coaches who have played against league teams two or three times during the hs season have a very good idea who deserves their vote and from what I see listed on the league web pages in my area they are pretty much right on. ?As far as newspaper articles, ?yes there can be errors in the form of typo or editing mistakes but it is not a deliberate slight, ?my dd has experienced this and she simply shrugged it off and played the next day. ? Since there are limited spots available there will always be a few players who get left off who may have a case for inclusion. ? I'm sure there are some coaches who don't have the ethics to vote in good faith but I think most do and as I stated earlier the players I see on the local all-conference teams deserve to be there. ?Now don't forget a player can be limited by playing in a good league, ? for example a weaker player in a weak league may make there all conference team when a stronger player in a stronger league may not make it because the competition level for all-conference team spots is stiffer. ?A local league had a team that gave that gave 408 runs in 22 games now having them on your schedule two times a season will inflate your offensive stats.

Its a numbers game, plain and simple....

Lets say there are 10 teams in your league. ?This would mean that roughly 120-150 girls are vying for first team honors. ?Let say the league only allows 12 first team players, and 12 second team players, and 1 Honorable mention per school. ?This is a total of 34 girls that are able to receive honors, leaving 86-116 girls that will receive nothing.

No matter how good one or two particular teams are, every one of the 10 coaches feels that he/she has a player deserving of 1st team, right or wrong, that's how it is. ?So each coach is going to lobby very hard to get one of their players on the first team. ?If every team is successful in doing this, there are now only 2 spots left on the first team, which will allow one or two teams to get a second player on the first team, which in all likelyhood will be one of the top two teams in the league. ?So everyone gets one, and several will get 2, and every coach goes home happy.

There are many scenarios that can be played out to determine who goes on the first team, but each coach has to go into the meeting with a game plan, and know the other players in the league, and where his players will stack up against those players.

Lets say the #1 team in the league has 4 girls that are the top players in the league, and there coach puts all of them up for first team. ?Then team # 2-3 has 3 girls deserving, teams #4-7 have 2, team #8-9 has 1, and #10 has none. ?
You now have 20 kids to vote on, for 12 available spots. ?So already we know, that 8 girls are not going to be on the first team. ?Each coach gets 12 votes, and they can vote for there own players. ?

So this doesn't ramble on forever, do you see where I'm going here. ?When you put to many players up, deserving or not, the votes start to get diluted. ?And players that should be getting votes will lose votes to other players. ?
The coach for team #1, that put up 4 players, has now diluted the votes between the 4 of them, and eventually, only one of them makes first team. ?Had he only put up 2, he probably would have gotten both of them on the first team.

The bottom line is, not all the most deserving will make it, and each coach has to know going in, what his/her chances are with their players, and do the best they can for the ones they feel are most deserving. ?

Believe me each coach is trying to get all these players awards, but its just not possible.

I didn't know the answer when I asked but based on all the personal mesages to me explaining what is really going on with these picks I now understand much better. ?I actually thought they were based on a player's performance, stats, leadership, hard work etc. which is why I asked. ? I could not understand ?how a team that is back to back league champs can have only one first team player. ?Makes much more sense now.[/quote]


Wow, Field only got one on the first team? After seeing them play several times, I'll have to say I'm a bit surprised. One thing that I will say is they are by far the most balanced team in the league, maybe having such good talent at EVERY position made it hard for the coaches to single in on the individuals. I thought that their centerfielder and catcher were both very good, but beyond that, no one really stuck out as a sure thing first team. Their pitcher was also very good, but was made better by the outstanding defense played behind her and the league had some darned good pitchers.

Would you please run down the first-teamers?

randyvw - people don't post the all county until after their awards night or when the paper puts out the list. ?

Lady_knights ? in our county......coaches voted by position. ?POY first then they went pitcher, catcher, 1st base 3rd base etc. ? So when each position came up they put up their pick. ? then coaches voted. ?It wasn't like "here our my 3-4 players up for 1st team" ?lets vote.

when it came time to vote...... the team that won 3 titles in a row only got 3 players on 1st team ?which were deserving and another one or two that were passed over for girls with lower stats ....... the team that tie with them this year (their first title in a while) got 4 including the POY plus COY. ?some of their girls had lower stats than other girls but they got on. ? So it is hard for me to believe that coaches truely vote for the best girl. ?It really shouldn't matter where they placed in the league but that the girl who really shined their position and had the stats and leadership be voted on.

Heres an interesting number......only 1 senior ?was voted 1st team for a position - 2 other seniors voted in for the 2 ?at large bids. ?Not saying that the underclassmen were better or worse but it is interesting that some of the seniors not voted 1st were 4yr letter winners and were very good in their position. But I feel when stats for the seniors are better or equal to an underclassmen it should go to the senior.....the underclassmen still have two or three yrs. to get theirs. ?Doesn't seniority count for something?!?!? ?JMO ?I still say it is all politics and the best girls for ?their position don't get on half the time. ?

Just seems to happen in this league alot sad but true. ?

This IS how it worked:

One individual, who is an AD from one of the schools, ran the meeting. He had there the rules to be followed during the meeting. First thing selected was coach of the year. Then, they went to Player of the Year. Each coach had the opportunity to present an individual, and then speak on their behalf. Then a secret ballot was cast, and the results were read out loud. Once that player was determined, she was not to be named on the first team in addition to her POY award. Then, they went through all the 1st team selections, starting with the pitchers. However many spots were being recognized at that position, that is how many votes a coach got. So, for example, 2 pitchers were chosen, so each coach picked on their ballot 2 pitchers, with the first one selected receiving 2 points, and the second one 1 pont. The ballots were read out loud, the points were totaled, and the winner declared. If there was a tie, then there was a runoff between the tied individuals. Positions where only one player was recognized, such as catcher, the coaches only had 1 vote each. As a coach arrogantly pointed out, she was only voting for her players, regardless of stats, so if every team who nominated a girl voted for their player, it was basically up to the 2 or so coaches who didn't nominate someone to determine the winner at a position. After all the positions were decided on first team, then they went to the "at large" position, which is just 2 more players, regardless of position. No, they did not go by stats, and they did not go by grade, as will be obvious when the players are announced. It will also be obvious who voted as a block by seeing who had the exact same number of girls recognized on the 1st and 2cd team combined.
? ?After the first team is selected, they do the same thing with the second team. Of note here, however, is when a coach sees his ?/ her player is being snubbed at her position regardless of stats or grade, players start getting nominated for their "other" position, such as outfield.
? ?After the second team is chosen, every team was able to name 2 players for honorable mention. These were not voted on, just named by the coach. Thus, every team got 2. ?
? ?So, to answer Plateprincess' original question, the answer is that there is no rhyme or reason, only politics. Scratch my back, I'll scratch yours, we get a group of 4, and we all can get 3 girls recognized. Wait until the list comes out. I'll have more to say at that time. ?

In at least one league in sw ohio a coach is not allowed to vote for their own player this helps with the "I'm not going to vote for anyone but my own player" thing.

In at least one league in sw ohio a coach is not allowed to vote for their own player this helps with the "I'm not going to vote for anyone but my own player" thing.

Now wouldn't that shake things up! ;D

It is almost all politics, and reward the seniors. To give a true reading, they should have coaches from another league vote on who is on what team!!

As I've said before the majority of picks are right on, given to deserving players. Having coaches from another league vote on an all-league team would not work since they don't get to see the players during league play they have nothing to base their votes on. They could go on stats alone but they are only part of the consideration and as noted earlier stats can be deceiving especially when comparing one league to another.

In the conferences that are not allowed to vote for thier own...How are votes cast? How do you know someone is not voting for their own?