Dp flex

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Bretman, Is this legal:

Team starts wth DP FLex, Flex is in CF.
4th inning DP swaps with Pitcher, Pitcher is now on the Bench Spot, DP is Pitching.
5th Inning, the Original Pithcer now in the Bench Spot swaps with the CF (Flex), Original Pitcher is now in CF and the Original Flex is on the Bench Spot. DP is pitching.

Here is the kicker. If you say NO, please point out the exact verbiage that disallows this.... in NHFS and/or ASA.

Thanks!

 

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I think this is legal however once the flex goes in for the DP, that girl is out of the game and not allowed to re enter.

 

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I think this is legal however once the flex goes in for the DP, that girl is out of the game and not allowed to re enter.

No problem with the substitution DP for Flex. I understand that. But if you read my scenario, we have swapped the DP for the pitcher (NOT A SUB) and we have
swapped the Flex, CF for the original Pitcher (NOT A SUB). THis is no different than telling the 1B to switch with the 2b.I would like to see the verbiage in the rule book that says this is not legal.

 

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OBTW, when the flex subs for the DP, she bats and the DP is out but may re-enter as with all substitutions. The lineup at that point is down to nine players from 10.

 

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Ya' know . . for some of us, this is like trying to read a Chinese phone book. I've been in softball for 12 years - Never understood Flex; never will.

Is there a Conversion Chart that defines Flex/DP/DH/Pinch runner/Courtesy runner/Substitute.

 

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IMO the above scenario is legal. DP and Flex can both occupy the field at the same time and move in and off the bench without a substitution. You just cant bat both DP and Flex in the lineup at the same time. If Flex bats for DP then you have to declare the substitution and the re-entry rules apply.

 

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Agree with Viper ... the scenario described is legal. Oiler pride ... if the flex does bat for the DP at some point, both the DP and the flex can re-enter once.

 

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You can swap the DP with any player other than the Flex on defense and no one has left the game; it is not a substitution.

The player removed from defense continues to bat in her normal place in the batting order.

The Flex can be moved from her starting defensive position to any other defensive position and she remains the Flex, and it is not a substitution.

 

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Team starts wth DP FLex, Flex is in CF.

Sounds okay so far!

4th inning DP swaps with Pitcher, Pitcher is now on the Bench Spot, DP is Pitching.

Legal. The DP can play defense for any player and can be in the field at the same time as the FLEX. This is not a substitution and the player replaced on defense by the DP is not considered to have "left the game" (for sustitution/re-entry purposes).

5th Inning, the Original Pitcher now in the Bench Spot swaps with the CF (Flex), Original Pitcher is now in CF and the Original Flex is on the Bench Spot. DP is pitching.

Technically, what's going on here is:

1) The DP is playing defense for the FLEX. This means the FLEX has "left the game" and must use a re-entry to come back in.

2) The original pitcher is back in the game in her original batting order spot. This does not require the use of a re-entry because she was only replaced by the DP.

3) The DP and the original pitcher have, essentially, just made a positional change, with the pitcher moving to F8 and F8 moving to F1.

The way you first described this, if I was the umpire and the coach told me that he wanted to "swap the original pitcher for the FLEX", I would have to tell him he can't do that. That player can only come back into her original spot in the batting order- nowhere else. The FLEX is the tenth batter, so the original pitcher obviously can't replace the FLEX in the batting order.

The move you describe can be legally accomplished, but it can't be legally accomplished exactly the way you described it!

 

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Team starts wth DP FLex, Flex is in CF.

Sounds okay so far!

4th inning DP swaps with Pitcher, Pitcher is now on the Bench Spot, DP is Pitching.

Legal. The DP can play defense for any player and can be in the field at the same time as the FLEX. This is not a substitution and the player replaced on defense by the DP is not considered to have "left the game" (for sustitution/re-entry purposes).

5th Inning, the Original Pitcher now in the Bench Spot swaps with the CF (Flex), Original Pitcher is now in CF and the Original Flex is on the Bench Spot. DP is pitching.

Technically, what's going on here is:

1) The DP is playing defense for the FLEX. This means the FLEX has "left the game" and must use a re-entry to come back in. This also drops the batting order line-up from ten spots to nine.

2) The original pitcher is back in the game in her original batting order spot. This does not require the use of a re-entry because she was only replaced by the DP.

3) The DP and the original pitcher have, essentially, just made a positional change, with the pitcher moving to F8 and F8 moving to F1.

The way you first described this, if I was the umpire and the coach told me that he wanted to "swap the original pitcher for the FLEX", I would have to tell him, no, he can't do that. The only player that can replace the FLEX is the DP.

The move you describe can be legally accomplished, but it can't be legally accomplished exactly the way you described it!

 

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Who's on first?

 

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Actually, I think the flex is kind of simple. The rule is the flex can only bat for the DP. As long as you don't change the batting order, you can do alot of things with it. But that is the key. Don't change the batting order.

 

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I've been using a Flex/DP regularly for 5 seasons now. I have to admit, the actual rule and some of the explainations had me pretty confused early on. However, I completly agree with raidian70; it is pretty simple until you start messing with offense. The sentence that helped me get it straight in my head: "When using a Flex/DP, you have 10 players that can play ANY defensive position as long as the Flex is never in position F10(Bench)." However, if you do put the Flex on the bench (taking your available players back to 9), she can "re-enter" the game one time and you can proceed to use any of the 10 players in any position. Mess with the batting order... ut oh, that's a different story. Right?

 

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I love the DP/Flex. I tend to bat as many allowed in pool play in any given tournament but it gives me my best 9 hitters and best 9 fielders in the game for bracket time. It gives you allot of FLEXability... Love it.

 

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Correction to what I said earlier ... yes, if the flex does come out of the game defensively and comes back in to play defense or to bat for the DP, then that is a substitution. Other than that, it really isn't as complicated as some people make it out to be, and it is a huge advantage to the coach who uses it. If there's one player not in your top 9 hitters who is a better defensive player than one of your hitters, you can play both of them in effect in the same position in the order ... best of both worlds. It's like a basketball coach at the end of a game putting in one person to play offense, and then putting in the other to play defense. Along with that, you can pretty much shuffle those 10 players around defensively without there being a substitution. For example, lets say your Flex was playing CF and your 1B was having a bad day defensively, or you just wanted the DP to get a little time in the field. The DP could go into play 1B while keeping both bats in the lineup. As mentioned above, the Flex can only bat in the order in the place of the DP, which is really the only limiting factor. When I coached high school, the Flex tended to be one of our faster players who we would send in to run when the DP got a hit (this was a substitution of course). We wouldn't bother usually to put the DP back in the lineup until her next at bat (you just have to remember to do this). But let's say the next at bat, you need someone to lay down a bunt, or perhaps the game is lopsided, the Flex could then get an at bat since she was still in the lineup from when she ran.

There is just never a situation when you can change the batting order, period!

 

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Call me Old School. (My daughter certainly does.) But whatever happened to teaching the kids how to Run, Hit, Catch, & Throw and use it all in the same game...?

 

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I think you do even when you use the DP/Flex but there is no way all 9/10 players are equal to each other in every skill. This allows a coach to have 10 players in a 9 player game and move the parts based on the situation.

 

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I think you do even when you use the DP/Flex but there is no way all 9/10 players are equal to each other in every skill. This allows a coach to have 10 players in a 9 player game and move the parts based on the situation.

Exactly, thus making for a cleaner game. Also includes another player that may be a substitute. Its a win/win IMO.

 

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Sounds okay so far!




Legal. The DP can play defense for any player and can be in the field at the same time as the FLEX. This is not a substitution and the player replaced on defense by the DP is not considered to have "left the game" (for sustitution/re-entry purposes).



Technically, what's going on here is:

1) The DP is playing defense for the FLEX. This means the FLEX has "left the game" and must use a re-entry to come back in. This also drops the batting order line-up from ten spots to nine.

2) The original pitcher is back in the game in her original batting order spot. This does not require the use of a re-entry because she was only replaced by the DP.

3) The DP and the original pitcher have, essentially, just made a positional change, with the pitcher moving to F8 and F8 moving to F1.

The way you first described this, if I was the umpire and the coach told me that he wanted to "swap the original pitcher for the FLEX", I would have to tell him, no, he can't do that. The only player that can replace the FLEX is the DP.

The move you describe can be legally accomplished, but it can't be legally accomplished exactly the way you described it!

Unfortunately, I know this is what is said. I know how it is implemented, but there is nothing specifially in the words of the rules that say you cannot swap the position.
If the DP comes off the bench, she can switch with any defender. Any defender can come back off the bench that originally switched with the dp, in my example, and can swicth with another player. I know techically the DP now replaces the flex and the flex leaves the game. But please show me the ruleverbiage that mandates that I cannot do wht is in my example.

 

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I've been using a Flex/DP regularly for 5 seasons now. I have to admit, the actual rule and some of the explainations had me pretty confused early on. However, I completly agree with raidian70; it is pretty simple until you start messing with offense. The sentence that helped me get it straight in my head: "When using a Flex/DP, you have 10 players that can play ANY defensive position as long as the Flex is never in position F10(Bench)." However, if you do put the Flex on the bench (taking your available players back to 9), she can "re-enter" the game one time and you can proceed to use any of the 10 players in any position. Mess with the batting order... ut oh, that's a different story. Right?

NOTE:
When using a Flex/DP, you have 10 players that can play ANY defensive position as long as the Flex is never in position F10(Bench)."

Can youshow the rule verbiage that states this?