Extension. Fact or myth

Discussion in 'Softball Hitting Discussions' started by BouldersDad, Aug 24, 2017.

  1. BouldersDad

    BouldersDad Member

    Sorry Chris I had to toss this out first. Is extension thru the ball important. And is proper finish a by product of proper extension? I know what I teach and have excellent results with it . Let's see what the masses think.
  2. cshilt

    cshilt New Member

    So, when do we get to extension, which is the straightening of the arm from a bent to straight position, is it before or after contact? I think you'll find that is usually in the follow through, and therefore a by product of a good hand path.
  3. SMc4SMc

    SMc4SMc Member

    Video. Some nice examples are great focal points and tend to get the ball rolling.

    Hmmm, or you could compare Carlee Wallace move to Meyers.
  4. cshilt

    cshilt New Member

    Is this good extension?

    Or this?

    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 17, 2017
  5. FastBat

    FastBat Well-Known Member

    /\/\I have always thought short to, long through, because the hitter is trying to hit the inside of the ball.

    The first example from Phil Schonberg, is short to-short through, that's what I call T-rex arms, and it's not powerful. But I see a lot of players swinging like that in the warm up circle, and I cringe.

    The second example from Phil Schonberg, is the short to, long through, extension after contact.

    The second picture you provided isn't good to me either, maybe I'm reading into it, but it looks like that's what I consider casting.

    The original question: Is extension thru the ball important?

    Yes! Once you make contact, you have to give it a ride! (That's what I've told my DD since she was very little.) The hitter shouldn't stop her swing half way though.

    And is proper finish a by product of proper extension?

    Probably, but I'm just a softball parent, and most parents don't get that technical. Although, most of us know when a swing doesn't look quite right.
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2017
  6. daytonfp

    daytonfp Member

    The second picture might be a good swing on an outside pitch. Shouldn't the belly button rotate (as the hip rotate) to the direction of extension. Toward the pitcher (pitch down the middle), to short/third (inside pitch), first/second (outside pitch). Obviously I'm assuming a right had batter here.
  7. manitoudan

    manitoudan Active Member

    exactly correct to what I believe dayton FP .
  8. tjsmize3

    tjsmize3 Active Member

    Maybe some are seeing things in these pictures that I can't, but the first video is so contrived that none of his swings look like what an actual swing would look like. In his "short to, short through" example he completely starts with an arm swing with minimal hip rotation and zero rotation of his upper body so there is zero connection. He then stops the bat midswing, holds it, rolls his wrists and finally turns his hips and upper body (now somewhat connected to the arms) in a manner I don't think he (or anyone) could replicate if they were actually swinging the bat. Physics would not allow this. In his next 2 examples he basically shows an arm swing. He is not well connected and his hips and torso are not rotated anywhere near where they need to be when he makes contact. Look where Joe Mauer's hips and torso are pointing at contact. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYAtN3HugNY
    Also, the second picture cannot be a hitter putting a "good swing" on an outside pitch, because first a good swing would never have the arms in relation to the torso at ANY point like this guy has them... it's completely contrived. Second, his hips and torso are nowhere near rotated enough to be at contact (even on an outside pitch... see Chris Davis on the outside pitch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhjVLH_zjGc ), yet his elbows are locked out in extension which if ever occurred like that would be way AFTER contact. These look like examples of people teaching a swing in a manner that they THINK happens vs. what actually happens when you look at video of good hitters.
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2017
  9. CoachB25

    CoachB25 Member

    I may be back with more to say later. I don't coach extension. To me, it is a byproduct. I want the hitter to point the knob, deliver the barrel. Most of the time, they are in a position of power when contact is made unless they have a push swing caused by several factors but including being fooled on a pitch. I want that position of power on all ball locations on the plate. So, I don't coach to extend to hit the outside pitch. Instead, I coach to let the ball get deeper and over the approximate position of the mid part of the plate or where the angle goes back to the back point. The ball down the middle will be hit with the ball right at the front edge of the plate and the inside pitch hit out in front. (Naturally, depending upon the batter's position at the plate.)

    IMO, trying to teach extension often results in a push swing and a weaker swing. The further the hands get away from the core the weaker affect the core will enable a hitter to hit the ball with the body instead of the arms. JMHO!

    Note, I am an "Ex Expert."
  10. Xrayaries

    Xrayaries Active Member

    Manny Ramirez had the sweetest swing in baseball.
  11. manitoudan

    manitoudan Active Member

    One thing that struck me was Manny's shoulder rotation in that video clip .. pitch is belt high . Not a low pitch at all and his lead shoulder is far far above his back shoulder . I know the lead should should be slightly higher but Manny's is really low . I think Manny would struggle with the rise ball if I were calling pitches .
  12. Ohio USSSA Pride 05

    Ohio USSSA Pride 05 New Member

    I think if someone teaches that extension thru the ball is important then they would answer "YES" to the second question and many of their hitters may have high bat speed after the bat has passed the ideal contact zone.
    They would probably also use deflated basketballs to show how this helps to get extension thru the ball. A deflated basketball will remain in contact with the bat for about 8" or so. This definitely would require the batter to continue applying energy to the bat after contact. However, A softball or baseball is not in contact with the bat long enough to apply "extension thru the ball". Unlike the 8" of travel while the bat is in contact with a deflated basketball the contact a baseball or softball has with the bat is about 3/4 of an inch. I would think that energy applied after contact is just wasted energy and would say extension thru the ball is important for hitting deflated basketballs but not so for hitting a baseball or softball.
  13. Ohio USSSA Pride 05

    Ohio USSSA Pride 05 New Member

    I think this is just a picture showing plate coverage without crowding the plate. I do not think this is a picture of a swing. In reference to George#5 Brett photo
  14. Maxdad

    Maxdad Member

    Extension, extension, extension, through the ball, through the ball, through the ball!!!! Have seen many a good hitter who have been taught this approach. But like everything else, may not be the best approach for everyone.

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