Hitting and Hitters Discussion Calling all Scorekeepers!!!

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Lady Knights is correct. E-6 then out 6-5. Sounds like the SS should have been able to turn a 6-3 double play by fielding the hard hit ball, stepping on second and throwing to first.

There are too many moms and dads out there padding the stats by handing out hits like they were Halloween candy.

 

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I think it would depend on the game situation...is the batting team losing and if so by how much? How many outs? What inning? If the runner on 2nd would tie the game or even bring them within 2-3 runs then FC, the SS can't afford for her to score, but if that runner means nothing then E6.

 

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From the Atec scorer's guide

Offense: Fielder's Choice
Credit a fielder's choice:
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1. When a ball is put in play where a preceding runner is forced out on the hit, or would have been forced out had no error occurred.
2. When a ball is put in play where a preceding runner who is forced to advance, is called out on an appeal for missing the first base she was to advance to.
3. When a ball is put in play where a play is made on any lead runner and an out occurs, or an out would have occurred had no error taken place, or the runner is safe, but the batter would have been out had the initial play been made at first.
4. When a runner is checked and no throw is made (a mere checking of a lead runner, or faking a throw does not constitute a play, unless no throw is made, but when a check is followed by a throw and the hitter is safe, credit a hit).
5. When after reaching any base safely, a batter earns extra bases because of a play on a preceding runner (not scored as a part of the original base or extra base hit).
6. When other runners advance while the catcher makes a play on the batter on a dropped third strike.
7. When a base is gained by a runner who is allowed to advance because of indifference (this does not necessarily apply in a first and third situation).
8. When a fielder makes a play on a base she thought a runner was going to, but was wrong, the batter baserunner would have been out with an immediate play at first.

However...

Defense: Errors
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]Guideline: Always ask, "Does the fielder deserve an error?" When answering always give benefit of the doubt to the hitter.
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The Bold type is in reference to a force play, the SS had one play on the initial play and that was at first. A base running error by an unforced runner does not make it a Fielders choice. That just IMO though lol.

 

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Correct! The baserunning error occurrs after the error causing the runner at first to be safe. It is incidental to the play, much as it is incidental when a hitter takes an extra base on a throw home after getting a single. Taking second on the throw doesn't make the hit a double.

 

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Correct! The baserunning error occurrs after the error causing the runner at first to be safe. It is incidental to the play, much as it is incidental when a hitter takes an extra base on a throw home after getting a single. Taking second on the throw doesn't make the hit a double.

u r so right on the double factor there...i always get a kick at the girls who scream triple from the dugout when it was a throwing error on the first baseman, or an outfielder who let the ball roll underneath her legs..

i also think lady and uber have persuaded me to rethink my initial response...i guess i was assuming this was a bang-bang play...here i am ready to pencil in the error, then lo and behold it ends up being a fake throw and put out at third....essentially, i was seeing it as one whole play, not breaking it down into its parts...

either way, no hit would have been rewarded, but i would have to have been there to be sure....a liner directly at shortstop and one up the middle that she almost gets are 2 different things

 

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Let's just say that the lead runner was on third, not second.

On the hit, she goes heads to home plate, and the SS (how did bobble the ball) plays on the lead runner and gets her out at home. The batter reaches safely.

That is a fielder's choice!

I think everyone is getting caught up on the fact that the fielder bobbled the ball. The ATEC scoring guide focuses on the outcome of the play - and that as an out. The defense gets to take credit for bad baserunning.

The lead runner was retired (and the guide does NOT say that that runner has to be retired on a force play), defense got an out - FC, no error.

 

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Mission accomplished!!! Everyone has gotten the ATEC out and dusted it off.

Just kidding.

As we all know, scorekeeping during the game is hectic. We do have the luxury of looking up the guidelines after the game and changing/correcting a scorekeeping error.

The girls in my dugout have learned that chocolate might influence a scoring decision. Just kidding again.

 

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But this SS faked a throw to first base after regaining control of the ball, had that not happened the runner would not have tried to advance, isn't this secondary to the initial play, making it a put out and not a fielder's choice?

 

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Was it beyond an average attempt for the SS to get to the ball? If the ball was fielded beyond normal circumstances then it could be awarded as a hit, I do believe this is a judgement call by the score keeper. It's not a FC in regards to the runner going to 3rd because the attempt was made toward the runner going to first. If SS attempt was an average attempt to field the ball then it is an error on the SS in regards to the batter. JMO