Catching and Catchers discussion catching thoughts

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Have a question to pose to the masses. This is regarding the movement of the catcher when throwing a ball to second base on a steal. I was taught one way that served me throughout college, and heard another way recently taught that is different. Without a demonstration, do you teach your catchers to catch the ball and spring up directly in place to throw the ball to 2nd, or do you teach them to catch the ball (almost moving towards 2nd), and throw the ball, ending up partially in front of home plate? Do you teach differently depending on age, and therefore arm strength?

 

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We teach our catchers to spring up and throw.........we have never taught them to ever come close to home plate.....with a step. This could be bad if the plate is wet or slippery.......And if you are wearing metal cleats.......it could be even worse. SPirng up and throw from that position. I have been to 3 catching clinics and they have all taught it that way...and warned us and the players to stay away from home plate.

 

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I teach wide stance, thighs parallel to ground, chest forward, throwing hand in fist behind glove, toes pointing fairly straight.

Catch ball, bring both hand and glove up to ear while pivoting on rear foot, elbow of glove hand pointing to 2nd base, step to target, throw, and follow through. Never end up in front of home plate. That is way too many steps.


Len

 

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Buckeye, I have to laugh, because what you are describing is what some of us old catchers call "old school", maybe because it is how we did it. . . Believe it or not I have seen this style being used at the collegiate level over the past couple of years.
I would say, it is what works the best with your catcher. Each style is developed somewhere by someone and other see it and emulate the style. This is true of everything from pitching, catching, batting, etc.

See what works and then make the decision. Note that if done right, you step to the side of the plate. I don't remember ever having slipped on the plate.

 

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC27b9JhxyA&feature=related

 

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I teach wide stance, thighs parallel to ground, chest forward, throwing hand in fist behind glove, toes pointing fairly straight.

Catch ball, bring both hand and glove up to ear while pivoting on rear foot, elbow of glove hand pointing to 2nd base, step to target, throw, and follow through. Never end up in front of home plate. That is way too many steps.


Len

totally agree with Lenski except for a personal mishap....I caught for 15 years and was also taught the hand behind the catcher's mitt and believed in it. All was good until a lazy throwing hand slid down from behind the glove and was exposed to a 93 mph fastball that was fouled straight back. Took my fingernail off completely on one finger and also broke the middle finger all in the same pitch. NEVER will I teach that again.

Quick feet is the key and snap motions.

I also dislike knee savers, works against balance in many ways.

 

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I teach wide stance, thighs parallel to ground, chest forward, throwing hand in fist behind glove, toes pointing fairly straight.

My daughter caught for about eight seasons and that is pretty much right in-line with what we picked up in clinics. One slight difference is the "toes pointing fairly straight".

I have heard to point the toes "outward" a bit- almost like you are pointing one foot up the first base line and one up the third base line. This is supposed to promote beter balance and make for a more stable stance. Also provides a quicker push off the foot if you have to move to the left or right and, when you pop up to throw, your foot is in a better position to drive off the back leg.

Another advantage I have heard with this is that pointing the feet outward takes some of the stress off the knee joint and focuses it on the larger, stronger thigh muscles. Saves wear on the knees and makes for a quicker pop up from the receiving position.

One other bit of footwork variation- instead of setting up with the feet "even", slightly offset the foot on the throwing hand side to the rear. This also is supposed to help with making quicker throws. When you pop up, your feet are in a more natural throwing stance. If your feet are even, you can tend to subconciously move your foot back to get weight on it as you start your throw.

Minor differences, but differences aimed at shaving precious fractions of a second off your throw-down times.

Knee savers- if my catcher wanted to use them, she had better use them right! She should NEVER have her weight resting back on them when in the primary receiving position. Use them between pitches, when giving signs or during breaks in the action the save a little wear-and tear on the legs. But when the pitch is being thrown, you need to be in the "thighs parallel to the ground" stance- that means weight OFF the knee savers! If your weight is back on your heels, you greatly increase the reaction time to come up out of your crouch.

 

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I have to retract my 100%, the outward feet is probably more in-line after re-reading the posts. That push off is key.

 

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My dd is a catcher and has always sprung from her position and thrown. She has been catching for 8 years and this will be her 3rd year starting varsity. My dd also took catching instruction for 3 years. She believes that if you were to spring up and then end in front of home plate that there are many things that could interfere with your throw. This is a list of things she thought could hurt the throw down.
1. where the batter is positioned in the box.
2. the type of batter whether it be a slapper or power hitter.
3. wasting time by trying to get to the front of the plate when you should have a strong enough arm to make the throw from behind home.

 

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My daughter caught for about eight seasons and that is pretty much right in-line with what we picked up in clinics. One slight difference is the "toes pointing fairly straight".

I have heard to point the toes "outward" a bit- almost like you are pointing one foot up the first base line and one up the third base line. This is supposed to promote beter balance and make for a more stable stance. Also provides a quicker push off the foot if you have to move to the left or right and, when you pop up to throw, your foot is in a better position to drive off the back leg.

Another advantage I have heard with this is that pointing the feet outward takes some of the stress off the knee joint and focuses it on the larger, stronger thigh muscles. Saves wear on the knees and makes for a quicker pop up from the receiving position.

One other bit of footwork variation- instead of setting up with the feet "even", slightly offset the foot on the throwing hand side to the rear. This also is supposed to help with making quicker throws. When you pop up, your feet are in a more natural throwing stance. If your feet are even, you can tend to subconciously move your foot back to get weight on it as you start your throw.

Minor differences, but differences aimed at shaving precious fractions of a second off your throw-down times.

Knee savers- if my catcher wanted to use them, she had better use them right! She should NEVER have her weight resting back on them when in the primary receiving position. Use them between pitches, when giving signs or during breaks in the action the save a little wear-and tear on the legs. But when the pitch is being thrown, you need to be in the "thighs parallel to the ground" stance- that means weight OFF the knee savers! If your weight is back on your heels, you greatly increase the reaction time to come up out of your crouch.

Pointing toes down the base line would be pointing them at 10:30 and 1:30 respectively. I teach to point the toes at 11:15 and 12:45 so it's fairly close. The further outward you flare the feet, the more weight you shift towards the heels and the further down the catcher's rear sinks, which means it will take longer to pop up. A good catcher reacts laterally off the balls of their feet so do not let them rest on their heels when someone is on base. I've caught more innings than I care to remember like that and my knees are still good, and probably the only good thing left on my body...LOL Seriously, the more weight shifted towards the heels the worse the reaction time. Don't get too staggered in your receiving position. I teach to stay as square to the pitcher as possible. I teach not moving the rear foot, I teach to pivot on the rear foot so no stagger is necessary. If you teach the "pop up, move rear foot to behind front foot", a slight stagger would help to shave reaction time.

I debate the position of the catcher's throwing hand with Chip all the time. He prefers it behind the back and I prefer it in a loose fist behind the mitt when someone is on base and behind the back with no one on base. In either case a lazy throwing hand is in danger so make sure the catcher does not get lazy with either set up.


Oh.....and Knee Savers are the Devil!:lmao:

Len

 

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One other bit of footwork variation- instead of setting up with the feet "even", slightly offset the foot on the throwing hand side to the rear. This also is supposed to help with making quicker throws. When you pop up, your feet are in a more natural throwing stance. If your feet are even, you can tend to subconciously move your foot back to get weight on it as you start your throw.

You have to make sure this is only a slight offset. If not the catcher could have problems reacting to some balls that are thrown to her left (if she is right handed). I definitely think you have to go with what works best for your catcher. I have had one catcher who had great arm strength and could drop to her left knee and throw a girl out at second. We made sure she did not over practice this as it would probably cause strain on her body. Everyone else has had to "spring" out of thier crouch. We told them to "jump switch". There is no real pivot on the back leg, instead quickly rotating your feet and hips around and driving off the back leg.

 

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My dd is a catcher and has always sprung from her position and thrown. She has been catching for 8 years and this will be her 3rd year starting varsity. My dd also took catching instruction for 3 years. She believes that if you were to spring up and then end in front of home plate that there are many things that could interfere with your throw. This is a list of things she thought could hurt the throw down.
1. where the batter is positioned in the box.
2. the type of batter whether it be a slapper or power hitter.
3. wasting time by trying to get to the front of the plate when you should have a strong enough arm to make the throw from behind home.

these are all 'regular' game issues...many of which a coach ignores and then yells at the catcher. I had a coach that played baseball at Ohio State and his coach taught him to work within the "envelope". To get this envelope, he had us catchers work at home plate and the other catchers (JV, Freshman, whatever) hold football blocking dummies in tight to the plate. We had to work through various positions of the pads while never crossing home plate and of course throwing to a 55 gallon garbage can. Now, sometimes as you know this forced us to throw outside or behind the mocked up batter. Worked Great!! Still had to do our fundamentals with our feet. He used to really really get on us for bad footwork and had us doing ankle and lower half drills to get muscle memory ingrained. Let me tell you, that man worked us over and I can't thank him enough. Sometimes his drills were "out of the box" when we had to stay in the box and it was pretty cool looking back.

 

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I am just curious as to the comment about setting the foot on the throwing hand slightly to the rear. I have seen catchers do that and wonder if they are at a disadvantage to bunts being hit on the non throwing hand side since their body is turned slightly away from that direction.

 

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In my opinion, a catchers body should never be turned. There are a few disadvantages to setting up angled. Dirt balls to the far glove side, covering bunts, weak hits to 3rd base side, and not being able to see the batter very well if they are set up on the glove side.

Len

 

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Anyone ever check out Dave Weaver's "Catching Camp" website?

The two links marked "Articles" and "Online Camp" have some good info.

http://www.catchingcamp.com/

 

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I believe I have visited there before, but it looks updated.

 

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I'm curious. In the secondary position (runner(s) on base), who here teaches their catchers to point toes down the lines and heels on the ground, and who teaches toes pointed more at 2nd baseman and shortstop, and heels very slightly off ground. I am assuming all catchers here are out of a deep crouch with runners on base. Also, while in secondary position, do you teach the fist behind the mitt or hand behind the back. I'll go first:

Toes pointed more towards 2nd & short, heels very slightly off ground.
Throwing hand in fist behind mitt.

Len

 

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I always disliked the hand behind the glove. I see it being taught more than it used to. I teach toes a little more towards 2nd and short, although it depends on what is more comfortable for the catcher. Definitely on the balls of the feet and off the heels.

 

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I always disliked the hand behind the glove. I see it being taught more than it used to.

Actually, the hand behind or near the mitt goes way back to baseball's infancy, went away around the late 1970's/early 1980's, and is now making a comeback.

Len

 

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Actually Johnny Bench changed this to the hand behind the shin guard. I caught for year's and we were all taught behind the glove. Now watching MLB ( Pierzynski - white sox) and Team USA softball , most now are putting it behind the Shin Guard. I watched team USA play this summer and Nuveman & Topping had it behind the shin guard. I'm with Lenski, I still think when you give the signal it is quicker to move it behind the glove and then to the ball. Since I'm a big Kobata fan, any extra movement is bad when fielding or throwing, so I would never want my catcher to have it behind her back. We would never allow our infielder to start to field a ball that way.