How hard is it to get on a really good team?

[FPMom2000]

I know that might seem like a stupid question, but tryout season is upon us and DD is a pitcher. She is looking for a new opportunity. Been with the same organization for two years and the team did fairly well. Better the first year than this previous year. While making it known that she wanted to get to the next level, its been discouraging to hear that "if you're not already on a solid 14u team by the time you get to the older 14u team, its almost impossible to get on" Just curious what your thoughts are on this. We have her tryouts planned, but a bit worried to hear that if you weren't picked up last year, good luck finding a team. And this wasn't just from parents/coaches on our previous team. Thanks for your input!

 

[wvanalmsick]

If her skill set is very good, then it is not hard to get on a very good team. But, beware, it is "What have you done for me lately." If she does not produce, they will find someone who will produce.

So, with that said, you need to sit down with her pitching coach, take off the mommy and daddy glasses, and get an honest assessment of where your DD pitching skills are. A good pitching coach will always be honest with you about your DD's skills. But be weary.

Go to try-outs for high level teams and get an assessment from the coaches there who have never seen your DD play. I wouldn't really depend on your present coach's opinion unless you know 100% that he/she has been totally honest with you in the past.

 

[mstat00]

If her skill set is very good, then it is not hard to get on a very good team. But, beware, it is "What have you done for me lately." If she does not produce, they will find someone who will produce.

So, with that said, you need to sit down with her pitching coach, take off the mommy and daddy glasses, and get an honest assessment of where your DD pitching skills are. A good pitching coach will always be honest with you about your DD's skills. But be weary.

Go to try-outs for high level teams and get an assessment from the coaches there who have never seen your DD play. I wouldn't really depend on your present coach's opinion unless you know 100% that he/she has been totally honest with you in the past.

This is a very honest answer.. And could not agree more. However I would like to add, regardless of what happens this tryout season, and what teams she may? or may not? Make.. Everyone progresses differently!
Encourage her to work harder! And as long as there is improvement, keep working. Also don't let your other skills laps, pitchers have to work much harder than most.

 

[Jack Jenkins]

Take her to another pitching coach for the evaluation, not that current coach won't be honest, but just a thought for an unbiased opinion and it will be helpful to potential coach to know you went to a neutral pitching coach for an evaluation. Get her on video, and if you can get video of her actual speeds as they are taken (on a rev fire or radar gun) get her stats from current coach and send them to head coaches of teams you want to tryout for, along with current video. If she pitched against any of the teams you want to tryout for, send those stats to the coaches too. Start contacting those coaches and communicating ahead of time, just showing up will not be your best strategy. Just like with college coaches it is good to develop a relationship with the coaches so they have some idea about her personality as well as yours.

 

[xathlete]

The problem is that an Excellent team usually is pretty much set by 14u. At this point the team has probably 9 girls that are loyal to the team, been committed to the team for a year or years, families are tight, positions are set, etc. IMO it's hard to walk in and take a position from someone that has already proven themselves in games and at practice. Also, you go to an excellent team and you make it......yes you made it, you are now part of a top organization, but remember one or more of the athletes will always have to sit out. You don't want your kid to be the one that is part of an Excellent organization but now sits more in one season than they every have in their career. Just how I see it, take it for what it's worth. This is one of the most stressful times of the year for a softball parent! Good luck!

 

[coachjwb]

I agree with others about getting an honest assessment, working hard, etc., but disagree that it's not hard to do. It is hard to do ... a lot of work to figure out which are the better teams with the better coaches, and which teams have the same goals and relatively similar talent level to your DD's. If you ever get a chance to listen to The Softball Zone weekly radio show or to the podcast of it, we started a series last week re: tryout season, and the next couple of weeks will be talking more about how to find the right team, what to look for and expect in tryouts, etc.

 

[travelinmom]

DD changed teams a couple of times in the last few years so that she could develop as a pitcher and get into the higher level tournaments. Coach responses at tryouts were varied (one guy told her she really wasn't a pitcher and should just play a different position) so she just kept trying out to find the right fit. The process of changing teams at 14U and 16U is difficult but doable. By 18U, girls seem to change teams with a little less drama.
DD knows what type of coach she works best with and has been basically happy with her choices (no coach/team is a perfect fit every day for a teen girl). She has continued to develop her skills and learned new secondary positions but being a pitcher at older ages usually means sitting the bench 1/2 the games. Knowing this, she chose a team for this summer that would provide a demanding travel schedule filled with competition and is heading to college this fall feeling ready to play college-level ball.
The choice needs to belong to the girls because they are the ones playing the game. Good luck in your search!

 

[CARDS]

All teams are looking for pitching 14-18U and as she develops her skills that is what will determine her chances of what type of travel team she makes not what team she played for last year...

What is your opinion of a really good team?
EX: a team that wins a lot of games but plays a relatively local schedule? There are plenty of these around Ohio or, a team that plays a little tougher ASA schedule with plans on attending ASA/USA nationals this pool gets a little smaller or, one that plays or is invited to more high profile events with a significant amount of travel and college exposure very small pool of teams and you may need to venture out of Ohio to find one.

What do you mean by going to the next level?
This is a large part of her summer team selection. If your DDs aspirations is attending and playing for a larger university/college there is a lot involved besides getting on the right team. Having a private coach that has cultivated big school talent is also a must for a pitcher and they can help find a summer team to match the skill set.
Attending camps and clinics especially; the ones of her school of interest is important. During this process the pitching coach and college coaches/yourself can see where she falls in the talent pool.
NCFA camps, Q Sport events can also help in see where her talent will get her. There is work to be done at the smaller divisions of softball as well but, an Example on DIII/NAIA we had 2 from our 2013 HS team/class that is playing D3 and 1 NAIA ball with only one playing a couple years of local travel ball.So she can find a team at the next level regardless of summer team she plays on with some hard work. If she is a D1 talent it will show if not that will show as well and she can make her choice to find the school that is the right fit with athletics and course of study.

 

[FPMom2000]

All teams are looking for pitching 14-18U and as she develops her skills that is what will determine her chances of what type of travel team she makes not what team she played for last year...

What is your opinion of a really good team?
EX: a team that wins a lot of games but plays a relatively local schedule? There are plenty of these around Ohio or, a team that plays a little tougher ASA schedule with plans on attending ASA/USA nationals this pool gets a little smaller or, one that plays or is invited to more high profile events with a significant amount of travel and college exposure very small pool of teams and you may need to venture out of Ohio to find one.
the goal is for the last one, but realistically the tougher ASA schedule/nationals seems to be the next step for my DD

What do you mean by going to the next level?
This is a large part of her summer team selection. If your DDs aspirations is attending and playing for a larger university/college there is a lot involved besides getting on the right team. Having a private coach that has cultivated big school talent is also a must as a pitcher.
Attending camps and clinics especially; the ones of her school of interest is important. During this process the pitching coach and college coaches/yourself can see where she falls in the talent pool.
NCFA camps, Q Sport events can also help in see where her talent will get her. There is work to be done at the smaller divisions of softball as well but, an Example on DIII/NAIA we had 2 from our HS team that is playing D3 and one NAIA ball with only one playing a couple years of local travel ball.So she can find a team at the next level regardless of summer team she plays on with some hard work. If she is a D1 talent it will show if not that will show as well and she can make her choice to find the school that is the right fit with athletics and course of study.

D1/D2 is her goal. She wants to do the clinics/showcase camps. (she attended one this year) Anything to improve her skills and learn more about the game. She has a pitching coach, hitting coach and conditioning coach. What she wants is a team that is dedicated to playing softball as much as she is. I think after this past season, she realized how important these goals really are to her.

 

[the cynic]

At 14 she needs to be throwing a game speed of 56-58 at least, with some movement . she needs to have at least two pitches that she can throw at any time FOR STRIKES . It would be a big advantage if she is 5'9 or 5'10 or above ( dumb college coaches really have a hard time with normal sized throwers) That is kind of a start IMO . Honestly to be really blunt , there are very very few that come thru each year that can throw at the D-1 level . If your kid isn't one of the best 10-15 throwers in the state already she isn't going to throw D-1 unless she has a huge upside ( getting bigger and stronger) That's tough love but truth is truth . Without quite a bit of God given talent AT PITCHER you cant work your way to a D-1 ride . I do wish you the best , try out for several teams that play a true top flight schedule , there are only a handful out there , don't listen to the rhetoric of travel coaches , do your research , look at the teams website , if it doesn't list who they have pout in D-1 the past few years then you probably are not looking at a top organization .

 

[FPMom2000]

At 14 she needs to be throwing a game speed of 56-58 at least, with some movement . she needs to have at least two pitches that she can throw at any time FOR STRIKES . It would be a big advantage if she is 5'9 or 5'10 or above ( dumb college coaches really have a hard time with normal sized throwers) That is kind of a start IMO . Honestly to be really blunt , there are very very few that come thru each year that can throw at the D-1 level . If your kid isn't one of the best 10-15 throwers in the state already she isn't going to throw D-1 unless she has a huge upside ( getting bigger and stronger) That's tough love but truth is truth . Without quite a bit of God given talent AT PITCHER you cant work your way to a D-1 ride . I do wish you the best , try out for several teams that play a true top flight schedule , there are only a handful out there , don't listen to the rhetoric of travel coaches , do your research , look at the teams website , if it doesn't list who they have pout in D-1 the past few years then you probably are not looking at a top organization .

I absolutely agree about being realistic. I'm not sure where she'll end up ..but I'm not gonna stop her from working her butt off. She is not tall. Will top out at 5'5" not speedy (is currently consistently at 55 mph.) but has very good movement on her curve, drop curve and screw ball. We just changed to a new pitching coach and she wants to focus on her legs as she is barely driving off. I appreciate real advice. You're right, truth is truth and I'd rather her learn it now than later on down the road. Thank you!

 

[coachjwb]

While I agree with a fair amount of what cynic said about being realistic, one thing I guess I would debate is whether she needs to be throwing 56-58 at age 14 or not. While it will likely take that or more to get a lot of D1 notices at 14, I have seen quite a few girls who added 5 mph after they were 14, and others who were very successful college pitchers in the 56-58 range. My DD was only about 50-52 when she was 14 (she didn't start till she was 13), and topped out about 56-57. She did receive a D2 athletic offer, but ended up going D3 which thankfully we could afford (kind of!) and which she had an absolutely great experience and many memories.

 

[CARDS]

Sounds like her current team has already packed it in....

I would suggest looking at eteamz, heybucket, 43ft and the OFC at teams needing players and hook up with one going to a bigger national.

There are a ton of 14 and 16U teams looking for pitching help at some of the better events around the country over the next two weeks...

This could be a Great opportunity to test the waters vs. the top teams around the country and try out some teams.
We did this when our DD was 11. Our team decided not to do a national so she hooked up with another team and ended up winning a 12U ASA B national. Had a great time and played with a very good group of players. Fall Ball is another area to check out some teams...

As far as the try outs, Sounds like she is looking for more showcse type teams than a tournament team.
In this case keep all doors open. There are several teams within a 3 or4 hr drive that could be a good fit. A lot of showcase teams are building on talent as opposed to age specific so, some very soild 16U teams could have 14U eligable players.
I have seen more and more teams the past two years with graduation years from freshmen to seniors on 18U clubs and some 16U teams with 13 year olds. (8th graders).
This is a trend I think we will be seeing more in the midewest over the next few years.

 

[Fairman]

Your daughter is exactly where she should be, don't let anyone tell you where she can end up and put a lid on her aspirations. If she adds even a single MPH over the next 4 years she'll be knocking on the 60MPH club, if she develops a few nasty breaking pitches to go with a devastating change-up then the world is her oyster. (My dd added 5MPH her sophomore year in college)

Ohio State, Robert Morris and St Francis are all D-1. Not all D-1s are massive state schools. There is a wide variety of schools that fit in that classification. Schools like Robert Morris often recruit overlooked local talent, but even OSU has more Ohio kids on the team than they have had in the past so even that D-1 maybe a possibility.

The majority of our dd's will not play D-1. The first reason is that there is 5 times the opportunities at the other levels. The second reason is that your dd's will not delude themselves that they can make a living playing softball and will take their education opportunities much more seriously. Playing at the D-1 level is lot like taking on a second full-time job, your dd may not be willing to pay that price. She may choose to dominate her opponents at the D-3 level. There is a lot of talent scattered across the classifications. She might want to pick a school where she could contribute as a freshman or a school that has a coach that can make her a better player.....The reasons for her choices are legion and she is more than likely not to choose a D-1.

My point is that the 'Holy Grail' of playing D-1 may not be in the best interests of your dd. I urge you not to feel disappointed if she is a D-3 athlete. She still gets to play a game she loves for 4 more years, unlike 100 of her high school peers that didn't go on. She will get a great education, perhaps pick-up a double major and graduate in 4 years.....priceless.

As to tryouts...She needs to play for a team that will use her but not abuse her. At 14U she needs to be on a team with at least 3 healthy pitchers in order to get enough work to improve but not to much that will hurt her. If she makes a Gold showcase team with 5 pitchers she won't get enough work to make the experience worthwhile. (Sitting on the bench at a showcase must be the definition of insane) If she is the stud and she is getting 40 innings a weekend she won't survive the summer unhurt and will loose development time. Guesting is a great way to find her current level and tryout the fit with a new teams/coaches.

Good Luck

 

[Fairman]

PS: You said your dd was throwing 55. What is her RPS?
If she is throwing 55MPH and is getting 20-25RPS then she will be virtually un-hittable. (You can measure the RPS on a Rev-Fire gun)

Most of us are idiots and only look at the speed and then say how important movement is but seldom note the RPS numbers when we are talking about our dd's.

 

[dawgpound19]

Excellent post Fairman, speed is not everything and as she gets older you can't throw the ball past hitters like you could at 10 and 12U. Most travel ball teams that are good can hit 55+ pitching all day every day so go ahead and throw the ball 56-60 with no movement and we'll see how that works.

 

[Fairman]

Dawgpound
The only fastballs that my dd throws in a college game are off the plate and just for effect and usually no more than a handful. We call a 60MPH fastball on the white of the plate....a double.

Her off-speed pitches is what is getting the job done. She commonly exceeds 25RPS on a mid 50's pitch and can break her curveball 18" with downward break. (we measure the break by putting a string about 12' in front of the plate.....hit the string and measure the break) and If she powers up and overthrows that pitch; the MPH may increase but the RPS falls and the pitch either flattens out or breaks to late.. we also call those doubles.

(I'm sure you've seen the 62MPH D-1 prospect get hammered in the 18U games if she has never had to develop any other pitches. She may have been dominate at 14U but almost anyone that throws hard and doesn't walk to many will have success; 18U will be another story)

 

[FastBat]

PS: You said your dd was throwing 55. What is her RPS?
If she is throwing 55MPH and is getting 20-25RPS then she will be virtually un-hittable. (You can measure the RPS on a Rev-Fire gun)

Most of us are idiots and only look at the speed and then say how important movement is but seldom note the RPS numbers when we are talking about our dd's.

I wish everyone realized this! Thanks!

 

[frenchy101010]

Call me stupid, what is RPS?

 

[weekendsoftball]

Revolutions Per Second