Indoor Tournament Indoor softball and OHSSA

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I know this has been beat to death somewhere on this forum but I could not find it.

I read the rule and it is clear but the date is Feb 1 - does this mean that after Feb 1 it is a violation?

4.7) Participation in indoor fast pitch softball is not a violation of OHSAA non-interscholastic
Sports Regulation 4.5 if played indoors from November 1, 2010, through
February 1, 2011, for student-athletes.


The rules state March 7 for team and Feb 21 for Pitcher and catcher - very clear but rule 4.7 leaves the door open for a violation after Feb 1- or am I just reading wrong?

 

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I'm not an OHSAA expert (not even sure the OHSAA people are!), but my understanding is that you can't play (even indoors) with more than 4 girls from the same school together after February 1 ... keep in mind that high school coaches can not coach them even indoors. The Feb. 21 and March 7 dates are the first dates that high school coaches can start to work with the girls.

 

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Thanks, I understand the 4 player rule but this does not mention that or take in account that situation. it clearly states the Feb 1 cut off as prior to is not a violation but says nothing about after . That is what I'm trying to figure out.

It is just like OSHAA to leave an open ended statement that causes confussion.

Their statement clearly states that durring those dates it is not a violation so are we to assume that any time outside of those specific dates that it is a violation?

 

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The rule changed last year. Those dates were put in the new rule.. So you will notice all the indoor high school teams cut off playing that day. Our last game at all stars is 1-29. After that most will be doing open gyms, then pitchers and catchers.

 

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OP ... in my eyes, the two are connected. Girls can play softball indoors or outdoors anytime they want, except during the high school season when they are not allowed to play outside of the high school team. What they can't do other than June-July, and November-January indoors is have more than 4 girls from the same school on the same team. So if the question is could girls still play indoors in the narrow window between 2/1 and 2/21, my assumption is that they could as long as there are not more than 4 from the same school and of course their high school coaches are not coaching them.

 

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Disagree. Key word is individual in section 4.1 , which is where the indoor rule goes back as a reference. If I can find it, the softball rule section by OHSAA posted the new rules changes last year and one was covering indoor play. Not only did they change the verbiage, they put in specific dates. If I can find the recap from last year they did a good job of explaining why they made this change. Old rule was indoor softball was not softball. So we use to play in Feb.

 

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High School teams are allowed to play as a team indoors between the dates SB put out, thats the reason Sinclair changed the High School tournaments to accomidate those changes.

Tim

 

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I know that the rule was changed last year ... I actually had passed this info on to the CSU winter camp/league folks. But SB - are you saying that your interpretation is that girls are not allowed to play at all indoors after 2/1? I still think the point of the rule was to say that indoors softball was not considered softball for the purpose of the 4 player rule, as long as play is completed by 2/1. But you seem to be implying that they now have said girls can't play indoors at all after 2/1 ... are you saying that if there was an indoors tournament one those first 3 weekends of February, that a 16-U or 18-U travel team could not participate even though they didn't violate the 4 player rule? Warren and the Outlaws would need to know that ... but I really don't think that's what the rule means.

 

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It is confusing, but why would they put the new cut off on 2-1, unless it applied. Last year no one set up any games after 2-1 for 16U and above. Like most OHSAA rules you have to read mutli sections and I cannot find the cover letter the put out last year on this subject. I just know we did not play any softball for travel teams after 2-1 indoors. I just went thru the indoor leagues and most will not have high school players, since they all seem to be 10U-12U-and 14U that have games in Feb.

 

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SB - you could be right. There have always been unanswered (or inconsistently answered) questions about how long girls could work with their travel teams ... up until pitchers and catchers report, up until everyone else reports, or up until the first game ... most travel organizations stopped when pitchers and catchers reported I think just to be safe and/or because they knew their girls would be making a big time commitment to high school ball at that time anyhow. Maybe they picked the 2/1 date to forever answer that question (which it obviously hasn't!), or maybe they picked it because they knew it had to be before the high school commitment time and it was a nice round number that would always work ... who knows?

 

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I have some lawyer friends who read the rules and can't figure them out. Ask cgs about some of our conversations. I have been anti OHSAA for years, because they are no longer about the kids. Some of this stuff just seems to political. JoeA1010 or cgs chime in if you read this, since both of you are legal back grounds.

 

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I haven't read these rules and am not inclined to do so, but I find it difficult to believe - even for the OHSAA - that they would try to ban individuals from playing softball outside of the school season. In fact, I don't think that would even hold up in a court of law.

Plus, it simply makes no sense to allow athletes to play softball outside of the school realm from the end of the high school season all the way through Feb. 1, and then say they can't play from Feb. 1 to the start of pitchers and catchers.

 

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I haven't read these rules and am not inclined to do so, but I find it difficult to believe - even for the OHSAA - that they would try to ban individuals from playing softball outside of the school season. In fact, I don't think that would even hold up in a court of law.

Plus, it simply makes no sense to allow athletes to play softball outside of the school realm from the end of the high school season all the way through Feb. 1, and then say they can't play from Feb. 1 to the start of pitchers and catchers.

The problem is Joe most of the stuff they do makes no sense

 

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The problem is Joe most of the stuff they do makes no sense

Amen, brotha....

 

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Ok, I read the regulations. Bottom line is that individuals are fine to play indoor after Feb. 1.

The softball regs say indoor softball is not a violation of general sports regulation 4.5 between Nov. 1 and Feb. 1. General sports regulation 4.5 addresses the 50% limitation. So, the 4-player limit is not in effect for indoor ball from Nov. 1 to Feb. 1, which we all knew. That is all that the softball regulation is saying. The general rule rule limiting individual participation in non-interscholastic softball during the school season (but not limiting it outside of the school season) is the pertinent rule for individual participation that doesn't violate the 50% rule.

 

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Ok, I read the regulations. Bottom line is that individuals are fine to play indoor after Feb. 1.

The softball regs say indoor softball is not a violation of general sports regulation 4.5 between Nov. 1 and Feb. 1. General sports regulation 4.5 addresses the 50% limitation. So, the 4-player limit is not in effect for indoor ball from Nov. 1 to Feb. 1, which we all knew. That is all that the softball regulation is saying. The general rule rule limiting individual participation in non-interscholastic softball during the school season (but not limiting it outside of the school season) is the pertinent rule for individual participation that doesn't violate the 50% rule.

That was my understanding as well. If you look a number of the indoor venues (Spano Dome, Gplex, etc) either had 16u/18u tournaments in the first 2+ weekends of February of last year (the first year the rule was in place) or this year.

 

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Life was easier when these girls were 10u and 12u! Since my daughter is now a freshman and I have some freshman on my team Im getting a crash course in all these wonder bylaws.

 

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What if you have one freshman who wants to play on a team full of 7th and 8th graders (14u) that is still eligible, can she play indoor from March to May?
Even if she is playing high school ball.

 

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No ... girls playing high school ball are not allowed to play travel ball at the same time.

 

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Some of you guys are funny! :lmao: