Loaning out players

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Maybe not loaning out players, but allowing or permitting your players to play for another team or organization.

When do you say enough is enough?

Do you limit your players to how many times they they play in a week/weekend?

The situation plays out like this. They are 10U players that play on an established 10U team. Their team (the 10U team) is down one girl to begin with and only has 10. Some of the players have been asked to play up on an 11U team in the same organization for some league games and for some tournaments. These girls can definitely play at that level. It is a vast array of positions. Pitchers, catcher, SS, 3B and utility players. What worries me is it that it seems like the girls are being asked to play up not due to injury, prior commitment or an unforeseen circumstance of said team, but more for their ability to play well. It's flattering for the girls to be asked to play up, it really is. But it worries me on a few different levels.

Some of the worries are:

Over use. If these girls are normally playing an estimated 60 games with us between tournies and league play, can they handle the additional games from another team?

Different coaching styles. We all have our different ways of doing things. I would hate to see them develop bad habits or do something different then what we have worked on all winter long that may be counter productive to what they have learned up until now.

Parents of the team they are being loaned to and their emotions. I don't think it's right to sit primary team players for loaner players. Short of what was mentioned above, injuries or unforeseen circumstances.

Injuries on the loaner team. This is huge for me. I don't want my girls getting hurt at all, let alone on another team. I think that speaks for itself.

Being asked to play and then sitting the entire weekend. I think if the girls and parent understand that they are being asked to supplement that weekend because of what is mentioned above that would be understandable, but to show up and not play, kinda crappy, right?

We are in the same position to a certain extent with the loss of one of our players only a few weeks ago. It places us in a position that we may need someone here and there. So we want to play nice, but it seems like we (the coaches for each team) are on different pages with what they expect with the loaning of players.

Which finally brings me to the end; how do you guys handle it?

Do you go with your girls and watch them?

Do you coach them from the bench?

Do you avoid it all together?

Any advice for a new coach would be much appreciated.

 

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Rostering issues could be a huge headache. Each sanction has ther own rostering rules. The player could end up being frozen on another team's roster if you are not careful.

 

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It sounds like you've got all the answers, but would like some support.

Yes, all of your reasons are valid. My answer would be to stop "loaning" players completely. The intentions are good, but the end results are usually disappointing.

It sounds harsh, but keep your girls as your girls, only. You need to be concerned about the well-being of your team first. Let the other guy handle his own roster problems.

 

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Let me add...

Trust goes a long way. Do you trust the other coach to also teach the right techniques? Do you trust the other coach to not recruit your player? If you lose a kid to another team because of this, then you might want to look at your team and see why that player left.

Parents of the other team usually do not go after the loaner kid. They go after their coach, especially if their were sufficient players from that team available to play. If a team is asking for a loaner kid and there are sufficient players already, then that is a huge red flag that that coach is looking for players to recruit.

 

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My 10U daughter plays for other teams and gets asked to play up on our 12U "B" team. She is a catcher and comes in handy.

If she is feeling up to it we let her go. But she knows she will be sitting quit a bit. Last year she picked up on a team for NSA Worlds. And then sat the first few games. We had prepared her for this to happen so she was good. I think the single biggest issue is making sure there is clear communication to playing time expectations and to the all the girls and parents involved.

But in general we often do not go to many of her games when she is picking up. We have explained to her that our schedule is booked and we have commitments. So we do not focus much on what happens. There is alway someone we trust to take her to the games so she goes and has fun and reports back.

I think you have to look at each situation and see what makes sense. I know my wife is pretty open to letting girls go play for someone else as long as they ask first. It is a respect thing.

The one area I think that things get sticky are within an org. Teams have girls play on there teams to help them win and sit girls that are on the team full time. And this is where it gets sticky. As a matter of fact, I have to talk to our 10U coach this week over this situation. He brought a 9U pitcher along to get some mound time. And then played her in the field over a full time girl. That is not cool at all. So we will have to adjust how things are done............

 

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Just to put this into a context, it sounds like the question relates more to league play than to travel ball. These days, in travel ball, unless you are being "loaned" to a sanction that your home team doesn't ever play, there could be a serious downside to the sanction's position on whether you can return to play for your home team. Before you let your DD play on an off weekend for another team, make sure you aren't endangering her eligibility to play certain later tournaments with her home team.

I do worry that teams advertising for subs don't fully understand or explain these issues of continued eligibility to play for the home team.

 

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Good points. For instance...I believe in ASA if you roster up an age division you can't play back down in you age division the rest of the season. I also believe if you are rostered on a NSA roster then play for another team in an NSA tourney you can't go back to your team.

 

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As long as it isn't a qualifier or will effect my roster, I don't see anything wrong with it. I loan my dd out anytime she isn't playing, it gets her more at bats and field time. You have to go into it with the right frame of mind though. Your kid is there to fill in, not be a rostered player. She most likely will not pitch, catch, or play too much infield and will be at the bottom of the batting order. She will get to work her outfield skills, her base running skills, get some at bats, and meet new girls. You cannot go into it thinking she will hold the same positions as she does on her own team. Plus you never know what you can learn from other teams, she might pick something valuable up.

We always enjoy those games, not having to coach or worry about anything. We just get sit back, meet new people, spit seeds and watch them play.

 

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We just get sit back, spit seeds

Chuck wants to talk to you about This:lmao:

 

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Being an ASA District Commissioner, I want to re-affirm what Klump says. As long as it isn't a qualifier... i.e. State Tournament, Eastern (or any region) qualifier or National Qualifier, a player may play an any other team, regardless of age division.

 

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As long as it isn't a qualifier or will effect my roster, I don't see anything wrong with it. I loan my dd out anytime she isn't playing, it gets her more at bats and field time. You have to go into it with the right frame of mind though. Your kid is there to fill in, not be a rostered player. She most likely will not pitch, catch, or play too much infield and will be at the bottom of the batting order. She will get to work her outfield skills, her base running skills, get some at bats, and meet new girls. You cannot go into it thinking she will hold the same positions as she does on her own team. Plus you never know what you can learn from other teams, she might pick something valuable up.

We always enjoy those games, not having to coach or worry about anything. We just get sit back, meet new people, spit seeds and watch them play.

Could not agree more. If you go into knowing everything Julie said about playing time and look at it as a chance to get some extra at bats and help a team out that is shorthanded due to player conflicts or illness, then it can be a great experience and a lot of fun for everyone.

 

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As a general rule, I dont like it. You can never do everything to prevent all injuries, but that would really **** to have a key player on your squad get hurt playing on another team, either in or out of your org.

I would say protect your assets.

 

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We don't allow it once the team plays their first tourney of the season. While there are several reasons - the biggest is injury.

Our teams train all fall and winter and have an investment in each other doing all they can to be 100% dedicated and healthy for the 8-12 week 'season'. During June and July most of our teams only have 1 weekend off - the girls need that week to recover mentally and physically. If a Hawks team has a player need due to an extreme circumstance we look to other Hawks teams to help out.

The other is sanctioning risk - most parents have no idea what the exposure is for the player or team and everyone involved has too much invested to put that at risk. During spring friendly, indoor or fall ball season, we have no problem with loaning players but never during June/July..

 

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Chuck wants to talk to you about This:lmao:

That wasn't me!!!!! I was the one spitting the tobacky juice all over the floor. :lmao::lmao::lmao:

 

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Fast2Home has it right about the ASA situation, but please understand that most ASA tournaments are now qualifiers for ASA Eastern Nationals and, when that is the case, there are serious issues about being able to play future ASA qualifier tournaments with the home team.

 

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It goes without saying that DD's coach has always been in the loop and ASA qualifiers are off limits. I understand Doug's point of view regarding investment in a player and risk of injury and would respect that if that were the organization or teams policy.

 

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Being an ASA District Commissioner, I want to re-affirm what Klump says. As long as it isn't a qualifier... i.e. State Tournament, Eastern (or any region) qualifier or National Qualifier, a player may play an any other team, regardless of age division.

What happens if a girl is picked up from another idle team for a weekend and the team that picked her up won and accepted the bid to an Eastern national qualifier? Does this mean that if her normal team also wins a bid she would be ineligible or the team(s) would be ineligible due to illegal rosters?

 

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I've seen in this thread what ASA & NSA are saying about pick-up players. What is the stance for USSSA?

 

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What happens if a girl is picked up from another idle team for a weekend and the team that picked her up won and accepted the bid to an Eastern national qualifier? Does this mean that if her normal team also wins a bid she would be ineligible or the team(s) would be ineligible due to illegal rosters?

ASA locks (aka redlines) a player onto a team's roster when they begin championship play (e.g. qualifier, state/metro championship, Nationals) regardless of whether the team earns a berth or not. She would not be eligible to play for her original team in any ASA qualifiers, but could be picked up for nationals if the team she was locked onto discontinues championship play. This is exactly why so many posts warned about potential roster and classification issues, especially with the large number of ENQs in Ohio.

It seems like Ohio ASA is moving in the right direction by granting berths to Eastern Nats to all participants of the Strongsville "metro" tournament. All of your associations should do that with the participants of their championships and discontinue the ENQs. JMO...

 

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All these responses are great! Thank you very much for affirming some of my thoughts.

I do get the qualifier situation.

What I didn't make clear in the beginning post was this situation with the loaning of players is primarily in our own organization . Be it that they are playing up at 11 or assisting the 9U team.