ASA Tournament OFC Heatin' it Up announces tourney date

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I need to add, but first ponder this thought ,possibly a future debate topic.

Our experience with the Umpires deals w/ the Ole "Runner Does or Does Not Get Tie Myth"...... this weekend. First lets think of the UMP as a juror in a courtroom who is instructed by a judge they must render a guilty verdict(out) call unless there is reasonable doubt then they must render a not guilty or (safe) call.:

Our first game Sun (Against the Cannons very tuff team (would like to play again)) we were down w/ 2 outs with a runners on. The ump was camping out at ss (blocking the view of left field like they always do (another topic of discussion)) and as our player put the ball in play comes charging across the field to make his call at 1st (and believe me, gods honest truth a tie at first) has his hands halfway to the safe position....Stops and looks directly to the plate umpire for the call..... the plate ump gives him the ol" don't look at me nod" and after seeing my discussed look of him pausing ,calls our runner out:

Believe you me I was losing it inside to the point I couldn't even ask for an appeal, but what I did offer him was a "DON'T LOOK AT HIM ITS YOUR CALL, AND IF YOU HAVE ANY DOUBT THE CALL IS SAFE!!!!

Our Head Coach did ask for an appeal but of course was denied, GO FIGURE...

So let me know what you think on the association between resonable doubt and safe/or out call....I already know what to think about this weekends umpires.:lmao: (I like these little guys)

Cincy Static 99 would like to thank OFC (those responsable) :yahoo:for a very well run tournament, the competition was excellent!!: See you next year....:yahoo: (again I love these little guys)

 

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Take my word for it, in 2011 you will see some very good ASA umpires in this area.

 

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Actually Hippie28, there is no such thing in umpiring as a tie at any base. The batter is either out or safe and it is up to the umpire to make that determination. In math and science, the possibility of a tie is virtually impossible.

Len

 

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Lenski, what is that saying in the umpire clinics.... " When in doubt .... call them out."

 

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Take my word for it, in 2011 you will see some very good ASA umpires in this area.

So does that mean when the umpiring is bad next year we get to hang you for it??? There are 2 guarantees in life, birth and death. You better not open mouth and insert foot before 2011 even shows up.
I know you were at the Gene Harvey this weekend and the umpiring there was horrible. I talked to a gentleman/working tourney umpire for 30-45 minutes on Sunday and couldn't believe what he was saying. He flat out said the umpiring has gone down hill the last few years. Pay your $65 and here is your umpires license. He said USSSA hasn't put on a school/clinic in over 10 years. ASA does one every year he told me. ASA down to $25/game where as USSSA is $35-48 depending on the tourney. He told me the average age of most umpires now is 50+. Not too many young guys out there doing it.
I hope you are right and it does get better but you will have a LOT of people to prove that to. And if it doesn't get better, you better find a place to hide because the cast of characters on OFC will come find you.

 

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Three things Strohbro.....you forgot taxes.

Len

 

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Three things Strohbro.....you forgot taxes.

Len

LOL...Good point Len. But i try to forget that is a guarantee. If you don't pay them, you get a free state stay possibly with FREE room and board.

 

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Just want to add this isn't the only tourney we have had w/ sub par umps. I read a heck of alot more of these than I write, and it seems like it is every weekend!!!!

Where are the (umpire) report cards and are they still in affect?? Granted for every bad one there are two or three good ones and TDs and Assigners need to know the difference of the two . At least from a Coach's point of view.

 

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Umpires should get graded after EVERY game they do at tournaments or at league games. The coaches should get to grade them and turn the cards in to the TD's. This gives them feedback on who should and should NOT be at their events. Seems like an idea that should be in place every where. I know at the Ohio Wave's Treaty City the coaches turned in report cards after every game. Just don't know what was done after they got turned in

 

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So does that mean when the umpiring is bad next year we get to hang you for it??? There are 2 guarantees in life, birth and death. You better not open mouth and insert foot before 2011 even shows up.
I know you were at the Gene Harvey this weekend and the umpiring there was horrible. I talked to a gentleman/working tourney umpire for 30-45 minutes on Sunday and couldn't believe what he was saying. He flat out said the umpiring has gone down hill the last few years. Pay your $65 and here is your umpires license. He said USSSA hasn't put on a school/clinic in over 10 years. ASA does one every year he told me. ASA down to $25/game where as USSSA is $35-48 depending on the tourney. He told me the average age of most umpires now is 50+. Not too many young guys out there doing it.
I hope you are right and it does get better but you will have a LOT of people to prove that to. And if it doesn't get better, you better find a place to hide because the cast of characters on OFC will come find you.

I looked in the Gene Harvey thread and didn't see any complaints about umpires there like this thread and Doom tournament thread.

Your friend, whoever it is, was yanking your chain...LOL

USSSA has an umpire clinic in Harrison, Expressway Park, Beavercreek associations has one in the winter.. so I have no idea where that comes from.

ASA wants to pay $25.00 a game and you see where that got them so far this year with the quality of umpires... :lmao:

and please let me know where an Umpire can get 35 to 48 a game in USSSA as I feel I am being slighted then... as I and Bob Dean and the Gene Harvey pay the most for umpires. Bob at his event pays $35.00 per game and I pay $40.00 for plate and $35.00 for bases.

Beavercreek pays 33 -28 ( which is a two dollar decrease from last year .. which umpires I have talked to said THAT is going to change in 2011 as ASA is getting to look better in our District.. than USSSA.

Harrison pay $30 plate - $25.00 for bases... which some are not happy about that as well....

Expressway's pay I have no idea about.

Good umpires are doing baseball folks. Bottom line. Double header for $140 and home. That leaves the association supplying event with some of the 50+ age group. The young umpires are either doing :

a) umpiring baseball
or
b) umpiring in three man crews and going to Columbus, Indy, KY doing events.. based on money and those TD are willing to pay motels for them to come travel to their events because the umpires in THEIR area are terrible and they are looking like everyone is.. for better umpires.

The guys never asked for motels here.. Just don't cut the pay that YOU expect to pay umpires... nickle and diming the umpires... and the quality ones will stick around Ohio and umpire. If not, they are out of town.

Younger umpires are not coming to fastpitch... and I will tell you why point blank.

The "new" guys are getting the 10u and 12u games.. a lot of time one umpire system because these cheap TD's only want to pay for one umpire at these levels. They have a bad experience mostly based on cheap TD's and trying to make calls all over the field as a single umpire. It can't be done right .. that way.

Parents of these 10u and 12u teams ( not seasoned travel ball parents yet) screaming at the umpire.. Why take that abuse because of a cheap TD? Baseball here I come.. is their next thought.

 

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Sun dial or this clock... all I have to say...sorry, I'm enjoying my own humor more than you are I'm sure...

 

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I have seen an umpire using such an item, Lester.... and when the bell went off.. he'd run back and add 15 or 20 minutes to it...LOL

 

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Lenski, what is that saying in the umpire clinics.... " When in doubt .... call them out."

And the debate begins, Lenski I was waiting for that reply and Ohioquakerman sounds like you may have umpired in your day.

Lets look at it this way... and this is what I tell my DD/Players, "once the ball leaves the pitchers hand it no longer belongs to her it belongs to you so what are you going to do with it"?!!

When the pitcher lets go of the ball she only regains control of it IF the catcher catches it....but if the batter puts the ball in fair territory now she has control.....Advantage offense....it is now on the fielder(s) to throw her out at first base....Thus getting back control/advantage defense (an out).....But if there is a bang/bang play and inconclusive evidence and or doubt in the umpires judgement then the advantage remains with the runner and a safe call should be made.

The defensive team starts out with control via the pitcher and her different type of pitches putting the batter at a disadvantage so once she puts the ball into play advantage batter... I agree there shouldn't be any ties ever because it is still up to the ump make a """""""JUDGEMENT CALL"""""""" and when he can't this theology should come into play.... Any takers??;&

 

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I looked in the Gene Harvey thread and didn't see any complaints about umpires there like this thread and Doom tournament thread.

Your friend, whoever it is, was yanking your chain...LOL

USSSA has an umpire clinic in Harrison, Expressway Park, Beavercreek associations has one in the winter.. so I have no idea where that comes from.


Charlie Johnson is the gentleman who told me.

 

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Sun dial or this clock... all I have to say...sorry, I'm enjoying my own humor more than you are I'm sure...

I love it.

 

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Sun dial or this clock... all I have to say...sorry, I'm enjoying my own humor more than you are I'm sure...

Lester your eggs are done!!!!!!!:lmao::yahoo::lmao::yahoo::lmao::yahoo::lmao: (Did I mention I love these Lil Guys)

 

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When the pitcher lets go of the ball she only regains control of it IF the catcher catches it....but if the batter puts the ball in fair territory now she has control.....Advantage offense....it is now on the fielder(s) to throw her out at first base....Thus getting back control/advantage defense (an out).....But if there is a bang/bang play and inconclusive evidence and or doubt in the umpires judgement then the advantage remains with the runner and a safe call should be made.

The defensive team starts out with control via the pitcher and her different type of pitches putting the batter at a disadvantage so once she puts the ball into play advantage batter... I agree there shouldn't be any ties ever because it is still up to the ump make a """""""JUDGEMENT CALL"""""""" and when he can't this theology should come into play.... Any takers??;&

whoa.......easy. .
Are we talking tennis or softball here. Since when is a batted ball advantage Agassi? Lol. I mean advantage batter?

There are no ties, it's either safe or out. Unfortunately a lot of umpires are predisposed to make one call more often than the other. An umpire told me this weekend that in his umpire class they encourage them to take their time to make a call.....to actually SEE the entire play. I think that far too many umpires jump to conclusions before the play fully developed.....thus, far too many controversial calls.

 

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In 2011, the ASA District Commissioner will be supplying umpires to this event and should be a better quality umpires as a whole. I know ASA in southern Ohio has no association that umpires in SW Ohio that can fill a whole event with good umpires.

The same ASA umpires complaint at the Doom, now here, elsewhere in this area as well... and avenues are being put in place by ASA, especially in this district, for 2011 season.

Nothing like running a great event and have pitiful umpires sent to you as a TD.

This year, I know, many umpires wouldn't join the local association due to not being able to work games in their own district except two events.. both being mine in the Fall. Due to the fact this district has NEVER had a fast pitch umpires association.

There's been no determination in regards to what will happen next year in regards to umpires. We hope to have meetings with our UIC, ASA state commissioner before determining a plan of action. I've had lousy umpires and good umpires wherever I've been (including other parts of the state). This opportunity doesn't occur only in SW Ohio.

We are obviously dependent on the quality of available umpires, but we will complete our due diligence before taking action. It will be a year before we hold the tourney so there is plenty of time. Whatever action we take will be with the intent of providing the best umpires that are available. We are focused on running the best tourney that we can, including umpires.

 

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And the debate begins, Lenski I was waiting for that reply and Ohioquakerman sounds like you may have umpired in your day.

Lets look at it this way... and this is what I tell my DD/Players, "once the ball leaves the pitchers hand it no longer belongs to her it belongs to you so what are you going to do with it"?!!

When the pitcher lets go of the ball she only regains control of it IF the catcher catches it....but if the batter puts the ball in fair territory now she has control.....Advantage offense....it is now on the fielder(s) to throw her out at first base....Thus getting back control/advantage defense (an out).....But if there is a bang/bang play and inconclusive evidence and or doubt in the umpires judgement then the advantage remains with the runner and a safe call should be made.

The defensive team starts out with control via the pitcher and her different type of pitches putting the batter at a disadvantage so once she puts the ball into play advantage batter... I agree there shouldn't be any ties ever because it is still up to the ump make a """""""JUDGEMENT CALL"""""""" and when he can't this theology should come into play.... Any takers??;&

Been an umpire for 27 years this year and still having fun !!!

 

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There's been no determination in regards to what will happen next year in regards to umpires. We hope to have meetings with our UIC, ASA state commissioner before determining a plan of action. I've had lousy umpires and good umpires wherever I've been (including other parts of the state). This opportunity doesn't occur only in SW Ohio.

We are obviously dependent on the quality of available umpires, but we will complete our due diligence before taking action. It will be a year before we hold the tourney so there is plenty of time. Whatever action we take will be with the intent of providing the best umpires that are available. We are focused on running the best tourney that we can, including umpires.

My understanding by the District Commissioner himself through numerous conversations, in 2011 there will be an association for this district ( set up by the District UIC) and umpires will come out of this district FIRST before others from other areas are asked to come into this district... Just like it is for all of ASA in other areas of the State.

"Your" UIC will be the district UIC in 2011