Records- stolen bases

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Since we are talking about home run records, I have also noticed some other interesting things concerning records and stats in local paper. How about a kid with 50 stolen bases and a team with three kids with 90 plus stolen bases. Makes you wonder, but talking to the person who does the stat's for this team, they don't understand how to record a stolen base. Passed balls and catcher indifference from ATEC scoring , along with ROE's are not used. So it makes you wonder about records in high school. I know this isn't the only team, watching softball games then what is reported in the paper.

 

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Would have to agree with your assessment. I know in the early days of high school softball, the catchers were not as good making the throw, and teams would run wild. Especially vs. poor opponents. Any girl with speed had an easy stolen base. Today it is probably sloppy score keeping.

 

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Wow. Even a leadoff hitter is only going to be setting at about 90 at-bats around this time of year. Having 90 steals is an impressive feat, indeed. Now where did I put that rolling eyes smiley?

 

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I'm sure that many high school stolen base stats are inflated by what should have been wild pitches or passed balls. As we've discussed on this forum before, however, the "defensive indifference" thing is a little tricky. ATEC says it doesn't necessarily apply to first and third situations and MLB says indifference is more about a defensive team that is so far ahead it literally doesn't care about the stolen base. When scoring, I take the position that "indifference" is not the same as "being afraid to throw the ball" in the first and third situation. I therefore often credit a stolen base, even though I understand that it is a very different type of SB.

 

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Carol g- Reads score it as a fielders choice. We do not give credit as a stolen base. It says do not give credit for a stolen base for Defensive indifference. Chris the team has played 20 games so that is more than two a game. That is tough to do when she only got on base once in a few games against us.

 

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Yes, but ATEC never defines defensive indifference and in the stolen base section (g) and in the fielder's choice section (7), it notes an exception for the first and third situation. And the first and third situation is when the stolen base issue almost always comes up. I do wish that ATEC would do a better job of defining stolen bases in this situation.

 

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This really does make it tough when my daughter has always wanted a stolen base record. She's the lead-off hitter and is very fast. Our score keeper does it all legit, even if they see a slight bobble by the catcher-it is not a stolen base. Feel bad for the girls and the schools that are trying to do the right thing. Those girls will never be recognized. Softball educated people, however will look at the number 90 and know that it is way too false and basically discredit all the stats. That same school probably gives a triple when it is a single with two errors. ;&...:lmao:

 

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I just checked the NCAA softball scoring guide and it makes no exception to the general stolen base definition for anything called "indifference":

"STOLEN BASE
SECTION 14. A stolen base is credited:
a. To a runner who advances to a base unaided by a safe hit, putout, error, force, fielder’s
choice, illegal pitch, wild pitch, base on balls, hit batter, passed ball, interference or
obstruction."

There is no mention of "defensive indifference" for NCAA softball scoring. Without any definition of "defensive indifference" in ATEC, I prefer, especially in the 1st and 3rd situation, to credit the stolen base.

 

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we had played a lot of the season with " indifference" LOL MD

 

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Carol read b. 2). Pretty clear it is a FC. The exception you are noting is referring to f: Example she breaks to second base and a pick play at third is attempted . She then gets a stolen base, even though no throw to second. Even a double steal of second and third and throw is to third, it is a FC by the rules.
http://en.allexperts.com/q/Softball-2562/2011/4/State-scoring-rule.htm

Here is the rule for ASA and NFHS it is indifference. NCAA is different, so you have to use the set of rules that apply.

 

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we had played a lot of the season with " indifference" LOL MD

Now thats funny

 

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Setting the wide range of acceptable statistics keepping practices aside, there are too many HS teams out there that aren't very good. I have a feeling most of the top offensive stats belong to girls who's team plays weaker schedules (I'm sure there are a few acceptions). Not really an even playing field when some of the girls are facing top ranked pitching or hitting all season long and not just here and there.

 

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Some score a SAC for a ground ball out on a full swing if a runner advances. I have to think it ups the batting averages quite a bit.

 

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No. Rule 2. It must be a sacrifice, it must be a bunt,slap,slug or running slap. Many are not aware of the slap part. We had a parent question the hits we had given her dd. She said we robbed her of four hits, but she had no idea what a FC was. Her comment she hit the ball and was safe at first? We told her others in our area may keep books that way , but the correct ruling is a FC, and we gave her the rulings on a FC. ROE's are the next biggest issue in high school. Here is one for you that even the paper had wrong. Starting pitching is ahead and pitches only 2 innings of a 5 inning run ruled game. Does she get the win?

 

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Initfor51 ... one clarification ... you mentioned a bobble by the catcher causing the baserunner not to get a stolen base. If a runner was going on the pitch, and the catcher either bobbles it or even misses it altogether, the baserunner should be credited with a stolen base. Often however, the scorekeeper doesn't notice if the runner is going on the pitch, so when I coach I tell the scorekeeper if she was stealing. As for a bobble that's never actually dropped when the baserunner wasn't going, I'm not exactly sure what the rule says on this but I would credit them with a stolen base in this case as well, and am pretty sure this is the way it would be scored in MLB as well.

 

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Unless it's like a City League team where the scores are routinely in the 20s and the defenses are very weak, there is no way anybody is stealing 90 bases in a season. If a team played a 30-game season, a girl would need to average getting on base twice per game and then steal one base one of those two times and steal two bases the other time, every single game. If someone is on base ahead of her, that alone would make it nearly impossible. Oh, also, she could never get thrown out or else it would have to be made up somewhere else.

I don't even think 50 stolen bases is much of a possibility with accurate scorekeeping. Maybe Natasha Watley or Kayla Braud could get 50 against a decent high school schedule, but that's about it.

 

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I'm not sure if they meant the 3 girls together had 90, or just one ... either way, I agree ... there is some issue with the scorekeeping or the reporting of figures to the paper at least ...

 

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I'm pretty sure SBFamily meant that on one team, there was a player who had 50 SBs and, when she was joined by two other players on that team, the trio had 90 SBs.

 

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Boy I'm glad I'm not scorekeeping anymore.

 

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There is one girl listed with 320+ career hits - that would be 80+ a season. Would take an 800-900 batting average to do that