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Was wondering what people thought. Seems like woman are great at
teaching the game but usually not as good at managing it.
teaching the game but usually not as good at managing it.
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Sounds like a thread that will have the popcorn popping in no time. I wouldn't be surprised if Bear shut this down in a hurry if it gets out of hand.
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I don't know if since we are in the off season and you are bored you decided to throw out something, but here are my thoughts and I hope that Bear removes your topic-shameful...Everyone has their opinions, but if you are going to bulk us all together then gives examples for each one of us "women" managers to prove your point. Here is the example for me:
In my experience (being a female coach), The coaching is the easier part. The girls will listen to anybody that wants to teach them if you show them respect. The managing part comes from the differences with the parents. I have found that when a male assistant speaks-the parents listen. I have had to work harder with the parents.
Remember this is not all parents, but they sometimes will look at you like a girl. This is society that has been clinging to the notion that (like in the boys sports) men make better coaches. Not saying they make worse. Everyone can offer something.
In my opinion there are many ways to manage. I do paperwork awesome. Get things lined up. Learn more about the sport and teach the girls. The only hicup I have is some of the parents.
Example: My husband showed up to one of my practices and a parent asked him why he wasn't coaching. He stated that he watches the game, but can't teach it. He asked the parent why he asked him that and the parent said it just seems odd that the husband is on the sidelines and the wife is coaching.
Sorry went a little off topic-but just wanted to give you my experiences as a female coach. Every coach has a different experience so I wouldn't bulk all of us together in one question. It may have just been your experience with one or two female coaches or no experience at all just a random thought. I have worked very hard to earn the respect that I get and the coaching community (male or female) really doesn't need this put out there.
In my experience (being a female coach), The coaching is the easier part. The girls will listen to anybody that wants to teach them if you show them respect. The managing part comes from the differences with the parents. I have found that when a male assistant speaks-the parents listen. I have had to work harder with the parents.
Remember this is not all parents, but they sometimes will look at you like a girl. This is society that has been clinging to the notion that (like in the boys sports) men make better coaches. Not saying they make worse. Everyone can offer something.
In my opinion there are many ways to manage. I do paperwork awesome. Get things lined up. Learn more about the sport and teach the girls. The only hicup I have is some of the parents.
Example: My husband showed up to one of my practices and a parent asked him why he wasn't coaching. He stated that he watches the game, but can't teach it. He asked the parent why he asked him that and the parent said it just seems odd that the husband is on the sidelines and the wife is coaching.
Sorry went a little off topic-but just wanted to give you my experiences as a female coach. Every coach has a different experience so I wouldn't bulk all of us together in one question. It may have just been your experience with one or two female coaches or no experience at all just a random thought. I have worked very hard to earn the respect that I get and the coaching community (male or female) really doesn't need this put out there.
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So, you really want to start this, eh?
My 2 cents worth - and, yes I know that I'm a male sexist pig. But, could it be the same reason why a lot of people prefer men doctors over women, or "men make better teachers": Women may have the know-how/facts/experience/schooling,etc., but men have a better way of transferring the message to other people in a way they can understand. I don't know why...
Let the male bashing begin !
My 2 cents worth - and, yes I know that I'm a male sexist pig. But, could it be the same reason why a lot of people prefer men doctors over women, or "men make better teachers": Women may have the know-how/facts/experience/schooling,etc., but men have a better way of transferring the message to other people in a way they can understand. I don't know why...
Let the male bashing begin !
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IMHO They are not given a chance.
Although this is not a travel situation, I believe it falls into that category:
Our high school was looking for a new varsity coach this year. They had a total of 7 applicants. 3 were recent collegiate players (pitcher, catcher and infielder) with no actual coaching experience, the other 4 were men, one with high school coaching experience, the other 3 with rec ball experience and 2 of those had travel ball coaching experience. They were all interviewed and the girls were considered for all of about 30 seconds. Personally, I think they should have given them the chance. Instead they picked the man with high school coaching experience and a reputation for being a hot head. ;&
I want him to be tough because these girls have talent and the ability to get past the first round at state. (made it to the final 4 last season) But his reputation has him degrading the athletes. I intend on giving him the benefit of the doubt. After all you are supposed to believe NONE of what you hear, and only HALF of what you see. But I will be watching closely!
I would have preferred that the female players been given the opportunity...;&
Although this is not a travel situation, I believe it falls into that category:
Our high school was looking for a new varsity coach this year. They had a total of 7 applicants. 3 were recent collegiate players (pitcher, catcher and infielder) with no actual coaching experience, the other 4 were men, one with high school coaching experience, the other 3 with rec ball experience and 2 of those had travel ball coaching experience. They were all interviewed and the girls were considered for all of about 30 seconds. Personally, I think they should have given them the chance. Instead they picked the man with high school coaching experience and a reputation for being a hot head. ;&
I want him to be tough because these girls have talent and the ability to get past the first round at state. (made it to the final 4 last season) But his reputation has him degrading the athletes. I intend on giving him the benefit of the doubt. After all you are supposed to believe NONE of what you hear, and only HALF of what you see. But I will be watching closely!
I would have preferred that the female players been given the opportunity...;&
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What is your basis for this statement?
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IMHO They are not given a chance.
Although this is not a travel situation, I believe it falls into that category:
Our high school was looking for a new varsity coach this year. They had a total of 7 applicants. 3 were recent collegiate players (pitcher, catcher and infielder) with no actual coaching experience, the other 4 were men, one with high school coaching experience, the other 3 with rec ball experience and 2 of those had travel ball coaching experience. They were all interviewed and the girls were considered for all of about 30 seconds. Personally, I think they should have given them the chance. Instead they picked the man with high school coaching experience and a reputation for being a hot head. ;&
I want him to be tough because these girls have talent and the ability to get past the first round at state. (made it to the final 4 last season) But his reputation has him degrading the athletes. I intend on giving him the benefit of the doubt. After all you are supposed to believe NONE of what you hear, and only HALF of what you see. But I will be watching closely!
I would have preferred that the female players been given the opportunity...;&
Now I have experienced the opposite up North. I have seen ex-players chosen over proven male coaches just because they were females and played the game. Regardless of sex, a good player does not necessarily mean they will be a good coach... i.e. pro basketball, baseball, football.
I have male and female coaches and actively recruit female coaches who have good managing skills. I am very lucky to have an ex-player who is an awesome coach.
I agree with Initfor51, sometimes young females are not given the respect by the parents, other coaches and tournament directors. I encourage young female coaches to stick with it and hold your own.
I have also had young female coaches that did not work out well. Fortunately this has been in the minority of the times.
Thank you Jenn B, Carly F. and Sarah B. for being awesome coaches.
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Bah....there are LOTS of good female coaches out there, and I've learned much from them. Since they're probably a minority in numbers, I suspect that you're forming your opinion based on a limited pool of them that you've been exposed to.
I know that some players and/or parents have their preferences, but I suspect that it goes both ways.
My opinion is that it's providing the best opportunities to the players by giving them exposure to both, if possible.
I know that some players and/or parents have their preferences, but I suspect that it goes both ways.
My opinion is that it's providing the best opportunities to the players by giving them exposure to both, if possible.
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Here is my take for what it is worth... I feel that most female coaches are not given a fair assessment by dads. Quite a few players are pushed into the sport by their fathers, who are looking for that sports connection with their DD. Face it, what do most men have in common with their young daughters?! I know this from first hand experience, LoL.
In my years as the head of an organization I have had quite a few Female head coaches and assistant coaches. The ones that were more assertive with the girls turned out to be the most successful. The ones that wanted (needed) to be liked by all I found to be knowledgeable, but eventually caustic to the team environment. Those that were less demanding or unsure of how assertive they could be experienced less success, but they all progressed to be more assertive.
If I had it to do all over again, I could help my DD make better decisions on who she would play for. I can honestly say that I would rather her play for a quality female coach (see learning experiences above) if the option was available.
In my years as the head of an organization I have had quite a few Female head coaches and assistant coaches. The ones that were more assertive with the girls turned out to be the most successful. The ones that wanted (needed) to be liked by all I found to be knowledgeable, but eventually caustic to the team environment. Those that were less demanding or unsure of how assertive they could be experienced less success, but they all progressed to be more assertive.
If I had it to do all over again, I could help my DD make better decisions on who she would play for. I can honestly say that I would rather her play for a quality female coach (see learning experiences above) if the option was available.
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That answer is simple. Most women never had to (or were allowed to) think for themselves on the field. They always had some overbearing, manipulative, power-hungry coach controlling every move they made. The coach called every pitch. The coach critiqued every swing. What the coach rarely did, however, is properly manage the game while explaining to his/her players why certain moves were being made. In other words, remembering what the whole process is actually about-- teaching the kids how to play the game.
"Ladies, when we go into the field for the 7th inning, I want the outfielders to play exceptionally deep. They have the heart of their lineup coming up. We're ahead by two runs. I don't want any extra base hits. If they do get a runner on second, please remember that the first runner doesn't mean anything. It's the next batter that represents the tying run. We want to make sure she doesn't get to second base. Where are we going to throw the ball from the outfield if there's a runner at second and the next batter gets a hit? Second base. Not home. Not third. We want to keep the tying run out of scoring position. We don't care about the first run. It's the second run that counts. Got it? Okay."
"Ladies, when we're running the bases this inning, please remember that we're down by three runs and it's the sixth inning. We need three to tie. Don't be out there dancing around. Don't be standing out there daring the catcher to throw you out. Just play it safe and give our hitters a chance to knock you in. If you're at first base and there's a hit to the outfield, you have to be 100 percent sure you can make it to third if you're going to go there. If you're not 100 percent sure you can make it to third safely, then just stay at second. If you're at second and there's a hit, I'll make sure there's no chance you can get thrown out at home before I send you. If I do send you, make sure you run as fast as you can."
"Mary, you're the lead-off hitter and you represent the tying run. We need you on base any way you can. This pitcher has been wild. Take the first pitch. If it's a ball, then take the next one. If she gets a strike on you, then bear down and have a good at bat. Once you get to first, we'll probably bunt you over to second. Make sure the bunt is down before you run. Be careful of the pitch-out pick-off play on the first pitch. That catcher can really throw."
"Baserunners, be mindful that it's been raining all day. The grass is wet in the outfield. If you're at second and there's a hit to the outfield, we should be agressive and try to score. I'll stop you if I don't think you can make it, but it's always tough to make a good throw with a wet ball. Outfielders, keep that in mind. Just assume the other side is going to be aggressive. Assume everybody's going to try to score. Come up throwing and hit the cutoff."
The result has been generations of players who become coaches without ever having learned the intracacies of the game. Their parents have spent thousands of dollars on hitting lessons and pitching lessons-- but where can they go for "how to play the game" lessons?
"Ladies, when we go into the field for the 7th inning, I want the outfielders to play exceptionally deep. They have the heart of their lineup coming up. We're ahead by two runs. I don't want any extra base hits. If they do get a runner on second, please remember that the first runner doesn't mean anything. It's the next batter that represents the tying run. We want to make sure she doesn't get to second base. Where are we going to throw the ball from the outfield if there's a runner at second and the next batter gets a hit? Second base. Not home. Not third. We want to keep the tying run out of scoring position. We don't care about the first run. It's the second run that counts. Got it? Okay."
"Ladies, when we're running the bases this inning, please remember that we're down by three runs and it's the sixth inning. We need three to tie. Don't be out there dancing around. Don't be standing out there daring the catcher to throw you out. Just play it safe and give our hitters a chance to knock you in. If you're at first base and there's a hit to the outfield, you have to be 100 percent sure you can make it to third if you're going to go there. If you're not 100 percent sure you can make it to third safely, then just stay at second. If you're at second and there's a hit, I'll make sure there's no chance you can get thrown out at home before I send you. If I do send you, make sure you run as fast as you can."
"Mary, you're the lead-off hitter and you represent the tying run. We need you on base any way you can. This pitcher has been wild. Take the first pitch. If it's a ball, then take the next one. If she gets a strike on you, then bear down and have a good at bat. Once you get to first, we'll probably bunt you over to second. Make sure the bunt is down before you run. Be careful of the pitch-out pick-off play on the first pitch. That catcher can really throw."
"Baserunners, be mindful that it's been raining all day. The grass is wet in the outfield. If you're at second and there's a hit to the outfield, we should be agressive and try to score. I'll stop you if I don't think you can make it, but it's always tough to make a good throw with a wet ball. Outfielders, keep that in mind. Just assume the other side is going to be aggressive. Assume everybody's going to try to score. Come up throwing and hit the cutoff."
The result has been generations of players who become coaches without ever having learned the intracacies of the game. Their parents have spent thousands of dollars on hitting lessons and pitching lessons-- but where can they go for "how to play the game" lessons?
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Look at the elite teams in the state, and around the country.
And yes I'm bored and thought this would be a fun thread. Nothing more.
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Things are changing as the sport continues to grow. You have to remember softball as a high school sport is not very old. I believe the 1st state title game was in 1978, which is only 33 years ago. Through the 80 and 90's the sport continued to grow but over the last 10-15 years it has exploded. Look at the number of female coaches today compared to 10 years ago. Here is another thing to remember player that graduated in 1990 would be around 40 years old. As coaches go that not very old.
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Plenty of good female coaches, there is one problem females seem to prefer to play for male coaches. Both a female and a Male coach could say things the exact same way, coming from the male there is no problem, coming from the female coach the girls take it as "bi*chy". I've noticed this takes place around 14u on up. The reason is behind my pay grade, just my observations.
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My family looks at coaches as just that - coaches. No gender preference or respect issues. The Coach is in charge. That's how my kid has been taught. I've seen great coaches and not-so-great coaches - male and female.
At my job, I've seen great managers and not-so-great managers - male and female. It's all the same - people should earn their job and the title that goes with it. They should also get the respect that goes with it.
It's a shame that people still have gender discrimination as part of their psyche - it's all about their upbringing. Don't stereotype people and your kid won't either.
At my job, I've seen great managers and not-so-great managers - male and female. It's all the same - people should earn their job and the title that goes with it. They should also get the respect that goes with it.
It's a shame that people still have gender discrimination as part of their psyche - it's all about their upbringing. Don't stereotype people and your kid won't either.
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Because most women aren't willing to commit that amount of time when they are the primary caregivers to the children and the home. Most men coaches are Dad's who started coaching because they had dd's who wanted to play and figured they'd coach since they have to go watch the games anyway and it evolved from there. I know plenty of females that are great coaches...they just aren't willing to spend all that time away from their kids when they don't have one of their own involved.
There are great male coaches and female coaches. There are horrible male and female coaches and everything in between. I think people more readily accept a bad female coach than a bad male coach though...it's almost like they don't have to prove themselves as a coach just because they have played softball in the past.
There are great male coaches and female coaches. There are horrible male and female coaches and everything in between. I think people more readily accept a bad female coach than a bad male coach though...it's almost like they don't have to prove themselves as a coach just because they have played softball in the past.
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I agree with this. I would also like to add that I also think it's a personality thing. If you assume traditional roles, the women tend to be more nurturing, mothering, and sensitive. The men tend to be disciplinarians. I am by NO MEANS saying that women can't be disciplinarians, but the percentage who are more "motherly" is much greater. It's how we are wired. I think you will find that the most successful female coaches tend to be more "tough" than "motherly".
I think your best case scenario is to have a mix of both personalities on your coaching staff. One who can nurture them when necessary and one to put their foot up someone's rear when they need it.
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Give crystlemc a "harumph" !
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My experience from high school sports was that we pushed and tested our young female coaches and they usually quit. We never even tried it with our male coaches. It did seem to come down to having a "tough" mentality as a coach to succeed.
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I would say it's undeniably accurate to observe that there are more men coaching fastpitch than women. Fairly rare to see women coaching boys teams, very common to see men coaching girls teams. Whether a coach is a good or a bad coach isn't a gender specific question, but you could reasonable expect there are more good male coaches just because there are more male coaches period.
In my household, my wife had played fastpitch in HS, and I stopped playing baseball around 5th grade. When faced with being told that the program my daughter was in needed a coach for the team or they were going to fold we discussed who should coach and my wife told me it was going to be me because in her words "I already do enough around here." My wife was working part time and managing our household full time so that was hard to argue with.
I've noticed trending towards more female coaches over the years and I think that it will continue to trend in that direction. I think that a generation or two down the road once Title IX has made it so that almost every househould contains two parents that participated in youth sports it will level out. I do think a large factor is that there are stilll today more adult men than women that participated in sports as youth and coaching any sport with zero experience is a tough sell.
In my household, my wife had played fastpitch in HS, and I stopped playing baseball around 5th grade. When faced with being told that the program my daughter was in needed a coach for the team or they were going to fold we discussed who should coach and my wife told me it was going to be me because in her words "I already do enough around here." My wife was working part time and managing our household full time so that was hard to argue with.
I've noticed trending towards more female coaches over the years and I think that it will continue to trend in that direction. I think that a generation or two down the road once Title IX has made it so that almost every househould contains two parents that participated in youth sports it will level out. I do think a large factor is that there are stilll today more adult men than women that participated in sports as youth and coaching any sport with zero experience is a tough sell.
