You Make the Call!

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Stolen from another site:

Some days in the bleachers are more boring than others... so I look for 'what if' or 'almost happened' situations. What are the calls from the resident experts?

1. R1 on 2nd, R2 on 1st. B1 hits ball to CF. R1 rounds 3B and heads home as R2 rounds 2B and heads to 3B. CF throws to cutoff, who turns and throws home. Catcher receives ball as R1 slides safely home. Fielder at 3B, anticipating cutoff throw that never came, was standing on 3B as R2 reaches 3B and makes contact, impeding R2's turn at 3B. FU indicates obstruction and 3B coach tells R2 to head home, where catcher is still holding the ball from play on R1. Catcher waits and politely tags R2 out as she jogs in to the plate. R2 wasn't obstructed from reaching 3B, she was obstructed from rounding the base. Catcher still had the ball, so there's no judgement R2 would have scored on the play had obstruction not occured.

2. R1 at first, B1 squares to bunt. Fielder at 1B was playing behind the bag and charges, just as R1 takes off on the pitch. Fielder and R1 collide. Pitcher fields ball down the 1B line that fielder at 1B would have legitimately played, and throws to 2B for the force.

3. R1 at 2B, R2 at 1B, 1 out. B1 hit pop fly to SS. Umpire calls infield fly, B1 out. SS loses ball in the sun and starts yelling she lost it. R1 sees an opportunity and takes off for 3B. Ball comes down and hits R1 on the helmet as she runs to 3B. Ball skips away as R1 ends up at 3B and R2 at 2B.

4. R1 at 3B, 1 out. B1 bunts the ball up the 1B line. Fielder at 1B charges as R1 heads home. B1, realizing she will be tagged out, stops and is standing still on the foul line. Fielder realizes she no longer has a double play opportunity, abandons the tag on B1 and throws home to keep the run from scoring. Throw from left-handed fielder hits B1, who is still standing still and upright in the baseline, not far from home plate. R1 scores.

5. And last... this actually came very close to happening. R1 at 3B, R2 at 1B. R2 is stealing on the pitch. Pitcher winds up and the ball comes out during the windmill, heading behind her towards 2B fielder (between 1B and 2B). Fielder charges for ball as R2 heads to second, causing a collision. R1 advances home as R2 gets back to 1B.

Enjoy. I'll check back later ;D

 

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So, Matt...what's your user name on "The Official Forum"? ?

 

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I will take a shot.

1. I think you mean to say in the last line "so there's no judgement R2 would NOT have scored on the play had obstruction not occured." R2 is out. Obstruction should not be an award of a base that the runner would not have obtained had the obstruction not occurred. Just like a runner diving back to first base and the first basemen blocks the bag without the ball. You dont award second base because she would not have gotten to second if the obstruction had not occurred.

2. When R1 and 1B collide with 1B making a play on the batted ball, you have an immediate dead ball, runner is out, batter is awarded first.

3. B1 is out on the IFF. R1 is out for Interference. 3 outs.

4. I know this from NFHS rules but am not sure if ASA is different. B1 can stop but cannot move backwards. If she does not move backwards ball is live, run scores.

5. Illegal pitch. Ball on the batter, both runners advance one base.

 

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I will take a shot.

1. ?I think you mean to say in the last line "so there's no judgement R2 would NOT have scored on the play had obstruction not occured." ?R2 is out. ?Obstruction should not be an award of a base that the runner would not have obtained had the obstruction not occurred. ?Just like a runner diving back to first base and the first basemen blocks the bag without the ball. ?You dont award second base because she would not have gotten to second if the obstruction had not occurred.

2. When R1 and 1B collide with 1B making a play on the batted ball, you have an immediate dead ball, runner is out, batter is awarded first.

3. ?B1 is out on the IFF. ?R1 is out for Interference. ?3 outs.

4. ?I know this from NFHS rules but am not sure if ASA is different. ?B1 can stop but cannot move backwards. ?If she does not move backwards ball is live, run scores.

5. ?Illegal pitch. ?Ball on the batter, both runners advance one base.

2 out of 5 correct!

 

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I'll give you the correct answer to that call on the first question.

R1 scores no problem she was safe. R2 was obstructed at third as rounding the base, she stopped went back to third, (would not have scored) was standing on bag. Ball was returned to the pitcher, coach saw left arm obstruction out kept telling her go home. She finaly after 3 seconds or so went by decided to go home. Pitcher throws to cather who tagged girl. Obstruction signal by umpire was longer there. Runner first committed herself to third base with ball in circle. Pitcher in turn raised her arm released her from the look back rule and went home slowly upon coachs telling her. She was tagged by catcher. the girl is out.

I was the home plate umpire.

 

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Forgot one thing field umpire never made the obstruction call his back was turned from the play. He asked me what happened. He waswatching fly ball and to make sure batter touched all the bases 1st and 2nd thats were batter ended up.

 

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I'll take a shot.

1) I agree with lewred

2) With the runner off on the pitch and the 1B charging when batter squared, I'll assume this occurred before the ball was batted thus not interference. So it would then be obstruction runner safe at second.

3) batter out. Runner out because of being hit by a live ball when infielder still had a cance to field it.

4) I think some rule books say you can't stop or go backwards when going to first (I;m not an umpire). If that is the case batter out and then runner at home out on the interference. If stopping is legal then runner out at home becasue of interference of ball hitting batter if she was in fair territory (outside the running lane). Otherwise everyone safe.

5)I think we have heard on other threads, a ball slipping out of a pitcher's hand is a live ball and would just be a ball on the batter. Thus, in this case ball is live and since it is not a batted ball, the collision is not interference on the runner. It could perhaps be obstruction on the fielder of the runner going to second or likely in the scenario presented incidental contact. I guess I'll say everything okay runner back to 1b and run scores.

 

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1. I agree with lewred and the runner would be out. You are only protected to the base an umpire feels you would have gotten if no obstruction was called.

2. I would have called the runner out at 2. The collision from what I am reading was incidental contact.

3. This is an interesting one. I probably would call the batter out on the infield fly rule and the runner out for being hit by a batted ball even though the batter would normally get first base in a runner being hit by a batted ball.

4. Run scores! batter doesn't have to be outside the foul line until 30' from home. She is allowed to stop, but not go backwards. Since she didn't intentionally reach out for the ball or anything like that, it is the fielders responsability to make a good throw.

5. I would say play stands as is.

These answers are probably the way I would have ruled if I were umping this game. I will now go and find out the right answers incase any of these would actually happen.

 

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Alright, I made sure not to look at anyone else's answers before I posted, so these are probably all wrong:

1) out
2) R1 out deadball; B1 to first
3) B1 out (IFF) R1 out; Double Play inning over
4) R1 scores, live ball
5) R1 scores; R2 safe at first

 

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I stayed out of of this one since I already read the questions on the other forum. But, I will add some comments to one of the questions that seems to be confusing everyone who answered (question #1).

The obstruction rule is that a runner cannot be put out between the two bases where she was obstructed. Since this runner reached third, then was obstructed while rounding it, she cannot be tagged out at either third or home.

As soon as she is tagged out, the ball is dead and the umpire awards the base that he judges the runner would have acheived minus the obstruction. With the leisurely jog to home and the catcher waiting with the ball, the runner likely would not have scored.

On the tag, call time and place the runner back on third base.

An "out" would be the correct call for Major League baseball, where the rule is completely different. Some of you might remember a similar play from a playoff game several years ago, (Miguel Tijada was the runner and was called out at home). Alas, that is a different sport with a different rule!

 

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If the fielder is standing at 3rd base expecting a play ( I would assume straddling the bag) how does the runner reach 3rd base before the obstruction?? I would think the runner would slow a little before running into the fielder at the bag or at the very least contact the 3rd baseman before contacting the bag.

 

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Actually I reread the initial post and it says the fielder is standing ON 3rd base.

 

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You are right- it does matter if the runner was obstructed before reaching the bag or while in the act of rounding it. If she gets obstructed before reaching third, she cannot be tagged out between second and third. If she is obstructed as she rounds the bag (ie: touches the base first, then is obstructed), she can't be tagged out between third and home.

The later was the scenario being discussed on "the other forum". So, this one has an element of "had to be there to see it", along with some umpire judgment thrown in.

 

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Bretman, if it was that close of a play would you give the runner the benefit of the doubt and say she was obstructed between third and home? I agree, have to see it to know, but in this case with the fielder on third, the contact would almost be at the exact same time as the runner touching third - who do you give the tie to??

 

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I will agree with you- you would really have to see it to judge it. If the runner was making an effort to round the bag, with the ball still in the outfield, as opposed to sliding into it or stopping there with a play being made at the base, I would probably give the benefit of the doubt to the runner.

 

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Thanks. Also, this got me thinking. A line drive to the gap with a fast runner. Probably a triple in most instances. What prevents the first basemen from "accidentally" obstructing at first base like is seen all the time. IF the obstruction is called, the runner is only protected to second base. If they slow her down enough she is only going to get second at best. Can an umpire call the obstruction and award third base if she never got there when the obstruction occurs at first base??

 

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While an obstructed runner cannot be put out between the bases where she was obstructed, that is just kind of a minimum starting point for determining her "protection". If the umpire judges that, minus the obstruction, she could have safely advanced further, then he can protect her to that further advanced base.

For your example, at the minimum the runner is protected between first and second. If I judge that the obstructed runner would have reached third, she is now protected from being put out anywhere between first and third.