Strange umpire request

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This weekend at Berliner I appear at the plate for the pregame umpire meeting and I handed the umpire my lineup card. I use the kind with four carbon copies. The umpire looked at me and said I'll need your original top copy. (This was the 2nd game of the day for us and the lineup...including positions were the same so I used one of the carbon copies from the game before.) Everything was completely legible and clearly marked with player numbers and the pitcher and catcher clearly identified. I said...Blue, I don't have my original copy. I used it this morning in my 1st game. He said...and I quote...well, you're gonna have to go get it.

I just smiled and said I'll make you out a new one. (My bookkeeper quickly made me one.) When I handed him the new one he said...I'll let it go this time but for now on I want 1st AND last names of all the girls.( I had all of their numbers clearly marked.)

I smiled and said...yes sir.

I've coached a lot of softball games. This was a 1st for me.

 

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I had that same request (top copy) earlier this year. Although my ump let me slide with the pink copy. As for names, I thought the actual ASA rule was first initial and last name. That's whay I always do and have never been questioned about it.

 

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I had that same request (top copy) earlier this year. Although my ump let me slide with the pink copy. As for names, I thought the actual ASA rule was first initial and last name. That's whay I always do and have never been questioned about it.

I really had no problem with any of his requests. That's why I didn't make a big deal about it. But honestly...I have been using 1st names and carbon copies for years(including ASA sanctioned events) and never had either request.

 

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LOL. I learned that one a longgggggg time ago - the hard way. Don't always get asked for it, but I always have the top copy with me when I go - with the numbers, positions, last name, and first initials; flex in position 10, and all potential subs duly notated. At first I was a little annoyed, but then I realized that that's what it takes to do it right, and it's the least I can do to show respect for the game and the professionalism I expect from the umpires working my games.

 

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We had an opposing coach refuse to put down his player's positions and I asked him to at least name his pitcher / catcher for courtesy runner purposes and he had a cow! Even worse, the umpires didn't know (yes ASA ENQ) he was required to put it down so I have the opposing coach and two umps looking at me like I was the problem.

 

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That's just weird. That you have to use the original copy isn't in the rule book, isn't in the umpire manual and has never been presented to me in any training class or clinic.

I wonder if there's somebody out there instructing their umpires to do this? Maybe they're afraid that somebody will alter the original copy after the duplicate is turned in. That doesn't really make sense. The official line-up is the one handed to the umpire. If a coach brought me some other piece of paper that said something different than what he handed me, guess what? We're going by the line-up he handed me. And it doesn't matter if it's written in crayon on a napkin!

The "by the book" requirement for ASA championship play is that the line-up must have the first name, last name, uniform number and position of each player for all starters and substitutes.

 

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You know from my personal experience with umpires, is that when they start the game off with some technicality or a personal rule(not ASA NSA ect..) , I find that most of these umpires have trouble keeping a consitant strike zone , out of position on a close call or lazy! Not all umpires , for the most part there are only a few of these umps out there. Ive wondered why these guys like to start the game off this way . I think it only invites scrutinity on calls that are close the rest of the game.JMO!

 

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You know from my personal experience with umpires, is that when they start the game off with some technicality or a personal rule(not ASA NSA ect..) , I find that most of these umpires have trouble keeping a consitant strike zone , out of position on a close call or lazy! Not all umpires , for the most part there are only a few of these umps out there. Ive wondered why these guys like to start the game off this way . I think it only invites scrutinity on calls that are close the rest of the game.JMO!

The umpiring last weekend was excellent in my opinion with the exception of this game. So you might have a point. And for the record...my team got the better end of most of the questionable calls.

 

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I had an ump do the same thing to me this season. After the game I asked why he wanted the original and he said the carbon copies are harder to read if the coach didn't press hard when filling it out and could be made illegible or distorted if a coach accidental set something heavy on it prior to giving it to the ump during the pregame meeting. Basically, it is the most legible copy.

Makes sense

 

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Well, if a coach hands me a carbon copy and it's not illegible or distorted, we're good to go. By the same token, if he gives me the original, but it looks like it's been waded into a ball, had a drink spilled on it and the coach's handwriting looks like something from my doctor's prescription pad, we're going to get it fixed.

The copy that the coach hands to the umpire is either legible or it's not. If it is, use it. If not, fix it. Seems kind of silly to request a different copy because the one you're being handed might be messed up, before you take two seconds to look it over and see if it really is messed up.

 

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Here's a question for Bretman then...

Elimination game, the other team wasn't using carbon copies. Gave us a lineup that was different than the one presented to the homeplate umpire. When the EP (Yes I know---NSA) was supposed to bat in our copy of the line-up, the other team went back to the top of the order. We questioned it and were told by the ump that his was official and that the other team only gave us a copy as a courtesy. Is this the common opinion in any sanction?

 

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We questioned it and were told by the ump that his was official and that the other team only gave us a copy as a courtesy. Is this the common opinion in any sanction?

This is standard procedure for every baseball and softball organization I've ever been associated with. The line-up turned in to the umpire is the official line-up. If there is any dispute about how many are batting, who is up or what position they're playing, the home plate umpire's copy of the line-up is the final word.

 

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thats why you should have an eagle-eye scorekeeper through the batting order..

 

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Not to change the subject, but we had an odd request in one game this weekend at Berlinger. Our girls were wearing the Under Armor thin sweat bands around their bicep area. Every girl had one on. Games 1, 2, 4 and 5 were good. But in game three the umpire stated the pitcher was the only one that was not allowed to use it. No big deal, she removed it with zero issues. But it was odd that only in that game the ump made such a stink about it.

 

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Must have had the same ump hapened to me in my first game down ay berliner. The rest of the tournament i don't think they even took a copy. Funny how things change from field to field .

 

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That's what drives me nuts, 90% of the umps don't want the line up card and when you hand it to them they look at you like your some nOOb, then another 10% from the high school ranks want it done by the book. Our team is printed in large font, at Stingrays the HP ump started with I need the original copy, which I had with me, so I handed it to him. We were batting everybody per tournament rules (Bat everybody free defensive subs) he hands it back and says I need their positions, I said they are written in and hand it back to him. He looks at it and says what position is this kid playing, I said she's just hitting so I wrote "EH", he says I need her position she's playing so I mention free defensive subs and he says ok but you need to write your team name on it I have no idea what team this is, so I show him the Large Bold Font with our name on it... After 5 mins he finally took the card lol.