Pitching and Pitchers Discussion Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most important

[default]

Excluding the fastball and change up, which pitch do you think is the most important and most sucessful. I know pitchers vary with their success with each pitch, but my question is directed to the merit of the pitch selected, not how well a pitcher delivers it.
Thanks.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

DD is an 08 grade, her regular pitching coach is Ashland University's Dave Leffew
and she is now starting to work with her future college pitching coach in Detroit - Jen Mackson of Grand Valley State U in Grand Rapids , Mi.....any ways both have said that college coaches are going away from Curve and Screw balls and focusing on Rise and Drop.....so they want 3 pitches primarily master Change , Drop , Rise......just an opinion...sure you can find college coaches that will disagree.... and can you really argue with a perfectly thrown screw or curve?

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

LUVFPSB, I agree with that. Here is a pretty good article: http://www.fastpitching.com/news.html

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I once heard Doug Gillis say that Vertical movement was better than Horizantal.... I agree with Rise and drop.... JMHO

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I'd have to say in High School a curve ball/screw ball is the most effective pitch if done correctly,Seldom do you see a good "Rise Ball" Maybe a pitch that doesn't drop as fast,but good hitters will lay off that pitch,Drop ball is nice but is harder to get the call from Mr/Mrs Umpire.Curve ball is deadly when you get the outside calls.
Now in College,I would agree that up and down might be better,depends on the level of play. Then again a bat is only so long and if you get that outside pitch hard to dissagree. My thought is have all of them and go with the pitch of the day.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

Not really sure that I would call the drop ball or rise ball a "junk pitch".

As far as which pitch is more effective I think that the drop and rise are much more effective then the curve or screw ball. The reason being as mentioned above the vertical change in the path of the pitch. It is much more difficult to adjust to. As hitters get better and play at a more advanced level they can more easily recognize the curve ball and screwball deliveries from the pitcher.

The curve tends to be very effective in the 12U thru 14U age groups becaue many hitters have still not seen a great one all that often so it can be effective.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I agree with most on the screwball/curveball, so I would say drop ball would be the best. Make a mistake with a drop its still probably low in the zone, make a mistake with the rise and its through the heart of the strike zone.

I think most of us would agree that the CU is the best junk pitch, so I think we are looking at the second best junk pitch.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I agree with the drop. A CU is very similar to the drop and that has my vote as the best "movement" pitch.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

Depends on the level of competition. Against h.s. competition, the riseball is more important because a h.s. pitcher with a good riseball can dominate, but against higher level travel ball players and in college ball, I'd say a good dropball may be more important because a great hitter with a high tech bat is more likely to put a good riseball out of the park, than a good dropball.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

Drop....drop curve is even better!

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

My dd goes to a pitching coach in Ashland and the most important 2 are Rise and Drop

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I agree with the article referred to by stp12. For college level pitching, the drop ball is the most successful pitch, followed by the rise ball. Different levels of hitting ability (such as 16-18u and 12-14u) will change the success rate of a pitch.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I voted for the drop but lets keep in mind that location truly is everything in pitching...a poorly executed drop should miss low which the percentages show will likely be missed or grounded if swung on. ? It is also more likely for a hitter to swing at a pitch below their eyes horizontal plane...its just harder to judge. ?On the other hand what happens with a poorly executed rise? ?If you miss high it is the easiest pitch to lay off of because it is the easiest to gauge since it is at eye level. ?If you miss low with it and contact is made...SEE YA!!! ?It has been my experience that you will have a MUCH harder time fooling a good hitter into swinging at a rise ball than a drop, change up or a curve on the outside of the plate. ?If you have a pitcher with a very strong curve (10-16 inch break) that they can work in and out with great control compounded by making it drop(drop curve)...Thats a weapon!!! ?You are now forcing the hitter to hit a ball on a different horizontal and vertical plane than it appears. ?The change up is a wonderful pitch too...especially when you develop a fast and a slow change. ? We all saw what happened to Tenessee...they were beat by the change up. Again, ?keeping a hitter off balance is key and that requires the use of more than one pitch and excellent location. The rise is a great pitch when used at the right times but it is also the hardest to learn or master.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

Drop and drop curve will get you the most outs.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

If you read any of the pitching sites www.pitchsoftball.com/page.html along with a few more. The #1 pitch to learn is the drop ball . Bill Hillhouse teaches it before he teaches you the change up. Screwball is thrown less than 10% of the time. The Riseball takes years to learn and few throw it correctly. Bill has a DVD on how to throw the riseball. Great learning device. I have seen many say they have a riseball , but have seen few at the high school level. I think I read on one of the softball pitching sites only 10% master this pitch before college. It also says above you have to throw it above 54 , which not to start an argument many can't throw that speed till they are older. .

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

dd played on a college tour team this fall and it seemed that batters were so patient and the umpires called such a small strike zone that the rise ball was hard to get called or the batter to swing at. the drop and the curve, which drops but not so dramatically were very effective. got a lot of ground balls to second base.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

? ? I totally agree with tmac... in particular with the older players. ?They are typically much more patient at the plate, laying off of the junk pitches, and using the count in their favor. ?A good rise or drop is really ?not ?a "strike" pitch. ?They are meant to fool the batter, coming so close to the edge of the strike zone and then shooting up/down out of the zone. ?Obviously pitchers can throw a drop/rise for a strike, but at that point, the advantage goes to the batter. ?IMHO ?
? ? I've seen good rise ball (as well as drop ball) pitchers be taken out of their game when batters lay off and start collecting balls. ?Once down in the count, the pitcher has no choice but to come back with something worth swinging at. ?Of course, I also believe that the umpire plays a huge part in what pitches work on any given day. ?No high strike, no rise...no low strike...no drop, etc.... ?If you are getting the outside.....a good drop curve is definitely hard to turn into a solid hit. ?It changes on both the horizontal and vertical planes...and if thrown well, will catch the outside corner of the plate for a strike time and time again. ? ?

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

I vote for Drop, atleast to this point. My dd is in her 1st year of 14U and I don't think I've ever seen a screwball thrown at any of her games. I'm assuming this pitch is used more with older, more advanced pitchers??

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

Inside Drop ball.

 

[default]

Re: Which Junk Pitch is most sucessful, most impor

My observations from behind the plate seem to show that a perfectly thrown drop or rise is most effective in getting the batter to swing and miss. The only drawback to the drop is the catcher not holding on to it and allowing the runner to advance to first base. You can live by the drop or you can die by the drop.