Fall ball/high school/Allowed to play?

Discussion in 'High School Softball' started by DynastyFastpitch, Aug 10, 2018.

  1. Captain_Thunder

    Captain_Thunder Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Once again - read the first line of what you are posting!!!! "FROM PREVIOUS YEAR'S ROSTER" for Fall Ball!!!
    So if they were not on the roster during the previous Spring - they DO NOT COUNT!!!

    In Mason, as well as other school districts - the Junior High teams are school sanctioned! So no more than 4 7th/8th Graders could be on the same team......but most districts are Club teams now.....But you could actually have 4 Freshmen & 4 8th graders on the same team by OHSAA rules...….
    First2Third likes this.
  2. Stedman00

    Stedman00 Active Member

    Not going to argue. BUT the previous year roster phase is referencing jv and varsity returning players. cannot have returning freshmen.

    from personal explanations, if there are 5+ girls on the same travel team in fall and winter and they all go to the same high school and all make the school team in the spring, there is the potential of forfeiture of games. The confusion occurs because of the length and overlap of seasons. fall outdoor and spring are considered the same sport, unlike indoor.

    as simple as I can make the explanation. Most travel teams seasons start 1 Aug. Team forms and plays together in fall tourneys practices, etc. and all winter . all is good. Come February, the stop practicing with travel team and they all try out for High school teams. Here's where the problem can occur. If 5+ girls on the same travel team, make the same high school team, and play in games, that's the violation. Has nothing to do with the actual travel ball program, is all about the high school season. And since it starts in essentially the middle of the travel / summer ball season.

    If this fall ball and violation was not in place, as well as the no contact period in August and work out restrictions on high school coaches, You would see high school coaches with entire year round travel teams playing together.
  3. First2Third

    First2Third Member

    Russ is correct on all counts.
  4. mamoneyoh

    mamoneyoh Member

    We have 6 girls on our high school team that play on the same travel softball team. We didn't have any problems last year when they were freshman (which leads me to believe they are not considered on the high school team until they make it their freshman year). This year, their sophomore year, they will have been on the roster the previous season so it will be interesting to see how this plays out. The problem I foresee is who is going to know and enforce the rule? It's not really fair to the high school coach, since they do not know who plays on what travel team. Not to mention, who's going to monitor travel team practices, games etc. It doesn't seem fair to the girls who have travel coaches that play by the rules to have to forfeit high school games. Either the rule needs to be changed or it needs to be made clearer so that there is no confusion.
  5. First2Third

    First2Third Member

    If they were on a school-sanctioned 8th grade team the year before then that would be a violation.
  6. mamoneyoh

    mamoneyoh Member

    Luckily, they were not.
  7. Captain_Thunder

    Captain_Thunder Well-Known Member Staff Member

    If you read what the rule is, you don't have much to argue! If you were not on the previous Spring roster - it doesn't refer to you!!!
    And if 5 freshman make the team in the Spring and don't start playing Travel Ball until Memorial Weekend and end by first of August, then they are not in violation. No harm until Fall Ball and everyone should be aware of the rule when trying out for new teams in the Fall!!!
  8. finfan365

    finfan365 Active Member

    I would be concerned if they are still on the same travel ball team this fall, that would definitely make them ineligible for HS ball in spring since they were on the Freshman roster last year.
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2018
  9. Chardon Storm

    Chardon Storm Member

    The head scratcher for me is that if the entire high school team can play together between the Friday before Memorial Day and July 31, why can the high school coach only lead them for 10 days of instruction/coaching (3-4 tournaments)? If the 50% limitation is removed for 2 months, it would make sense that the 10 days of coaching restriction should also be removed. More than anything, I think that particular rule really makes a quality coach think twice before taking a high school coaching position
  10. VE_05

    VE_05 Active Member

    You can have 4-8th graders and 4-9th graders all from the same school. Middle school and high school are considered 2 different schools. Once they start there freshman year in high school they are considered high school team in which they are not on any team at that point.

    This is all per

    Jerry Snodgrass | Commissioner/Executive Director | Ohio High School Athletic Association

    I can forward anyone the email that I got directly from ohsaa if you dont believe me or need proof.
    Captain_Thunder likes this.
  11. Stedman00

    Stedman00 Active Member

    Exactly as I had been told.
  12. Captain_Thunder

    Captain_Thunder Well-Known Member Staff Member

    Then why have you been claiming different the last 3 months? LMAO
    Jerry Snodgrass is saying that Freshmen are not any HS roster until Spring...
    First2Third and SonicMojo like this.
  13. Stedman00

    Stedman00 Active Member

    That's not how I read above.

    Once they start there freshman year in high school they are considered high school team in which they are not on any team at that point. I take it to mean that once they start 9th grade , they are considered on the high school team.

    You can believe what you want.
  14. Captain_Thunder

    Captain_Thunder Well-Known Member Staff Member

    I will go ahead and believe the rule you have posted on here twice now saying "From Previous Year's Roster" and believe OHSAA Executive Director that says freshmen are not on a team until Spring.

    You can chose to reinterpret and add sentences as you like......
    frenchy101010 likes this.
  15. Denver Roach

    Denver Roach New Member

    My interpretation is inline with the Captain/Russ...The player must have been on the previous years roster.

    It's a two prong test. The use of the word freshman doesn't necessarily include ALL freshman...but rather ONLY those freshman that were also on the previous years roster as well. Such would be the case in a situation that a student were to repeat their freshman year for what ever reason and was also on the previous years roster as well. It would not be the case for a first year freshman that was not on the previous yrs roster.

    Does that make sense to anyone else or am I way off base here?
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2018
  16. Xrayaries

    Xrayaries Active Member

    Too many conversations. My head is twisted right now
  17. Heavy Hitter

    Heavy Hitter Active Member

    Freshman do not count as part of the 4 player rule because the have not been part of the program, they have not made the team and are not on the school roster. Freshman have not made or tried out for the team nor were they previously in high school. Now here is the goofy thing, if a school has a school sanctioned middle school team then the 4 player rule would be in effect for freshman. Because they would be on a school sanctioned softball roster.
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2018
    mamoneyoh likes this.
  18. mamoneyoh

    mamoneyoh Member

    Looks like Heavy Hitter is correct: -Here are the 2019 rules:

    2) Non-Interscholastic Participation

    2.1) Softball Players Who Have Not Competed for Their School This Season: A sports regulation identified as the Individual Non-Interscholastic Competition Date stipulates that a softball athlete who has not participated for the school team in softball that season must cease non-interscholastic softball competition six weeks (28 days) prior to the Monday of the week of the State Tournament in softball in order to be eligible for OHSAA Tournament competition provided all other applicable bylaws and regulations have been followed. In addition, an athlete who has participated for the school in softball who violates this non-interscholastic competition date by participating in a non-interscholastic contest in softball shall be ineligible for OHSAA tournament competition in softball in addition to any other penalties that may be prescribed. Date: April 29, 2019 – No non-interscholastic competition permitted on or after this date.

    2.2) A member of an interscholastic softball squad (any student who has played in a scrimmage, preview or regular season/tournament game as a substitute or starter) sponsored by the Board of Education or other governing board shall not participate in a non-interscholastic program (tryouts, practice or contest) as an individual or a member of a team in the sport of softball during the school’s season (Sports Regulation 7.2).

    2.3) A member of a school Softball squad (any student who has played in a scrimmage, preview or regular season/tournament game as a substitute or starter) sponsored by the Board of Education may participate in non-interscholastic Softball prior to and after the school season under the following conditions:

    2.31) The number of interscholastic softball players from the same school on a noninterscholastic squad is limited to four on the roster of that non-interscholastic squad. A roster is defined as all the members of the entire squad on that noninterscholastic squad. Note: Graduating seniors who are participating on a non-interscholastic softball squad after their final interscholastic contest of the season in the sport of softball are exempt from this limitation.

    2.32) There is no limit on the number of softball squad members from the same school participating on the same squad during the period beginning Friday prior to Memorial Day weekend (May 24, 2019)–July 31, provided the players have concluded their school season.

    2.33) A player may continue to play with a non-interscholastic squad in a national qualifying tournament in excess of the four player limitation after July 31 until the squad is eliminated but no later than Labor Day.

    2.34) Non-interscholastic participation includes tryouts, training, practice and competition. SPORTS REGULATIONS 155 2018-2019 SOFTBALL

    2.4) A student may not play in a non-interscholastic softball contest, game or scrimmage, while a member of the school softball squad, until the student’s school team has completed its schedule. This includes tournaments when applicable.

    2.5) All-Star Games – “All-Star” events are non-interscholastic events by rule. Student athletes in team sports who wish to participate in one of these “all-star” competitions outside the school softball season may do so without jeopardy to eligibility provided the students maintain compliance with General Sports Regulations 7.3 and 7.6 that address “Non-Interscholastic Competition. The purpose of this special “All-Star” regulation is to provide an opportunity for the interscholastic team sport coach to coach players from his or her school. Coaches are permitted to coach in “All-Star” contests if they meet all the provisions of General Sports Regulation 7.6.

    2.6) Participation in indoor Softball is not a violation of OHSAA non-interscholastic Sports Regulation 7.3
  19. BouldersDad

    BouldersDad Member

    Ohio High School Athletic Association

    Lauren Prochaska, Director of Sport Management

    Softball Coaches Memo #2 - February 22, 2019

    Involvement with Travel Teams

    There have been many questions on this from parents and coaches. By now, nearly everyone is aware that participating with a player’s club/travel team is not permitted during the season. The REAL language of the regulation prohibits the player’s involvement while they are a member of the school team. Therein lies the confusion – a player becomes a member of the school team when she participates in her first scrimmage or game for the school team. Let’s take this scenario – practice began on Feb. 18. Your first scrimmage is March 3. The player does not become a member of the school team until she plays in the scrimmage on March 3. What does that mean? It means that she does not violate the non-interscholastic rule if she participates with her club/travel team until Mach 3. But…we also give the authority to all school programs to prohibit any outside instruction (which includes participating with club/travel ball) the day you begin practice if you make that policy known and clear to all players/parents. The bottom line, unless you prohibit it up until your first scrimmage or game, they do not violate the non-interscholastic rule up until that time by having any involvement with their club/travel team.

    Rules Meeting

    Make sure you complete the required state rules meeting prior to Thursday, March 21 at 11:59 pm to avoid the $50 late fee. If you’ve already completed the meeting, you can verify that you received attendance credit by logging into your myOHSAA account, clicking on the Rules Meetings tab and clicking My State Meeting Attendance on the left-hand side. You should see a date and time stamp of completion.

    Scrimmage Note

    Scrimmages can be used at any time throughout the season. If you are not able to get your allotted scrimmages in during the rainy/cold weather, you may use them during the season or during tournament. Just make certain that if YOU count it as a scrimmage – it is a scrimmage for the other team as well. It cannot be a scrimmage for one team and a regular season game for the opponent.

    Cold Weather/Minimum Temperature?

    I am often asked this in the early weeks of the season – do we (the OHSAA) establish a minimum temperature? The answer is “no” – it would be virtually impossible for us to do that. Your league COULD establish this if they choose to do so.

    Out of State Participation

    1. Schools may travel out of state to a BORDERING state to compete with no restrictions

    2. Schools may travel out of state to NON-bordering states ONE TIME per season provided no school is missed traveling to/from or for competition.

    3. Schools may travel out of state to scrimmage and compete in regular season games.

    4. Any scrimmage or game played against any team in-state or out-of-state must be considered the same type of contest for both teams. In other words, if it is a scrimmage for YOUR team it must be a scrimmage for the other team as well.

    5. Any contest played out of state MUST be played by all NFHS Softball Playing Rules.

    6. Licensed umpires must be used in all games played in-state or out-of-state.

    Transfer Bylaw

    Please consult with your Athletic Director on any transfers participating on your team. There was a major change to the transfer bylaw this year that now requires students who transferred after May 16, 2018, and who do not meet an exception, to sit out the second half of the season, including the OHSAA tournament. Your AD will be able to assist you on any questions related to this.

    Softball Regional/State Draw

    The softball regional/state draw has been conducted and is posted on the softball webpage at this link: https://www.ohsaa.org/Port
    finfan365 likes this.

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