default
Member
Are there restrictrictions regarding innings played if participating on MS 7th and 8th grade team?
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
I'm sure someone with a better knowledge of the rules can answer this one, but I'm also curious as what the question is leading to.
Is this about subs and their lack (sometimes) of quality playing time?--ie, our subs generally enter in the 5th or 6th innings, maybe bat once...but most of this is from quality of play
or is this about 7th graders playing up in 8th, and sitting on the bench there? --ie, I've seen this as well, when an 8th grade team doesn't have enough players, and the 7th grade coach sends up players who are not their best per se, but would ride the bench on the 7th as well..
but, since this isn't rec ball, I'm going out on a limb and saying that anyone can be benched at any time during school ball...I'm sure there are some school ball coaches here that spread it out, and while it may not always be even, it's usually due to the quality of play the girl possesses.
I'm sure someone with a better knowledge of the rules can answer this one, but I'm also curious as what the question is leading to.
Is this about subs and their lack (sometimes) of quality playing time?--ie, our subs generally enter in the 5th or 6th innings, maybe bat once...but most of this is from quality of play
or is this about 7th graders playing up in 8th, and sitting on the bench there? --ie, I've seen this as well, when an 8th grade team doesn't have enough players, and the 7th grade coach sends up players who are not their best per se, but would ride the bench on the 7th as well..
but, since this isn't rec ball, I'm going out on a limb and saying that anyone can be benched at any time during school ball...I'm sure there are some school ball coaches here that spread it out, and while it may not always be even, it's usually due to the quality of play the girl possesses.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
None that I see in the OHSAA., if the intent of the question is playing time.
None that I see in the OHSAA., if the intent of the question is playing time.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
There are no rules on the minimum or maximum amount of innings played per game for an individual player. The only possibility would be:
There is also no rule limiting the number of innings a pitcher can pitch within a week.
There are no rules on the minimum or maximum amount of innings played per game for an individual player. The only possibility would be:
There is also no rule limiting the number of innings a pitcher can pitch within a week.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
Please take this as being from the memory of an old guy. It seems that when the last of my DD's played Middle School (2 years ago) they were allowed to play 17 games, plus whatever end of the season tournament the league scheduled. IF that is the case, then I would assume the total number of games would apply whether they played 7th or 8th grade. (There is always the possibility my memory is faulty, or that was some sort of individual school rule)
Please take this as being from the memory of an old guy. It seems that when the last of my DD's played Middle School (2 years ago) they were allowed to play 17 games, plus whatever end of the season tournament the league scheduled. IF that is the case, then I would assume the total number of games would apply whether they played 7th or 8th grade. (There is always the possibility my memory is faulty, or that was some sort of individual school rule)
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
Dogs dad, you memory hasn't left you yet.
Dogs dad, you memory hasn't left you yet.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
So, a 7th grade player can play in all of the 7th and 8th grade games each week as long as they do not exceed 17 games per year?
I know in HS you are limited to a certain amount of innings per week if participating in the HS and JV games. An example in HS football would be if you play 2 quarters in the varsity game you can only play 2 quarters of the JV or Freshman game that week.
So, a 7th grade player can play in all of the 7th and 8th grade games each week as long as they do not exceed 17 games per year?
I know in HS you are limited to a certain amount of innings per week if participating in the HS and JV games. An example in HS football would be if you play 2 quarters in the varsity game you can only play 2 quarters of the JV or Freshman game that week.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
The OHSAA site mentions JV and Varsity, nothing about middle school/Jr. High. ?But it does mention the game restriction for High School level. ?If the logic was carried down to MS/Jr High, then you would be safe with the 17 game limit. ?Now if you have a 8th grade DH and a 7th grade single game on the same day, she would be able to do that once in the season, after that, only 2 total games on non-school days.
The OHSAA site mentions JV and Varsity, nothing about middle school/Jr. High. ?But it does mention the game restriction for High School level. ?If the logic was carried down to MS/Jr High, then you would be safe with the 17 game limit. ?Now if you have a 8th grade DH and a 7th grade single game on the same day, she would be able to do that once in the season, after that, only 2 total games on non-school days.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
To summarize what is pointed out above, the restriction is in the number of games permitted to be played by each player (17 MS, 27 HS). What often gets overlooked though is that we're not talking about innings, but games (see Section 11.A - 1.2) - thus if you pull a JV player out of the JV game to come up to the Varsity game and pinch run (or enter her into the game in any other way) that player has now played in TWO games of the 27 permitted; and should you have a freshman team or JV/B you could conceivably end up having to use up 3 of the 27. Same situation would occur at the MS level if a 7th grader is pulled into an 8th grade game. With all of the rain outs it's generally not an issue unless it's a constant routine for the coach.
To summarize what is pointed out above, the restriction is in the number of games permitted to be played by each player (17 MS, 27 HS). What often gets overlooked though is that we're not talking about innings, but games (see Section 11.A - 1.2) - thus if you pull a JV player out of the JV game to come up to the Varsity game and pinch run (or enter her into the game in any other way) that player has now played in TWO games of the 27 permitted; and should you have a freshman team or JV/B you could conceivably end up having to use up 3 of the 27. Same situation would occur at the MS level if a 7th grader is pulled into an 8th grade game. With all of the rain outs it's generally not an issue unless it's a constant routine for the coach.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
What is the advantage of having a sanctioned MS team? I know teams that are not sanctioned or affiliated with the school yet play all the school teams they want, sanctioned or not. These girls can still practice AND play with their travel ball teams without any concerns of eligibility. I don't see why anyone would want a school sanctioned middle school team and have to put up with all of the stupid rules of OHSAA. Am I missing something?
What is the advantage of having a sanctioned MS team? I know teams that are not sanctioned or affiliated with the school yet play all the school teams they want, sanctioned or not. These girls can still practice AND play with their travel ball teams without any concerns of eligibility. I don't see why anyone would want a school sanctioned middle school team and have to put up with all of the stupid rules of OHSAA. Am I missing something?
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
Depends on how cooperative the other middle schools are in your region. We've been pretty fortunate in our area in being able to participate in the OCC as a guest member, but I've noted that in some areas the sanctioned middle schools will not schedule an unsanctioned opponent (could be that the added administrative headaches aren't deemed worth the effort).
Unsanctioned sports are also less likely to get recognition (scholar athlete, etc) or consideration in scheduling (band concerts, getting out early to travel to a game, etc) from the school. Additionally unsanctioned teams tend to need to provide their own transportation.
Depends on how cooperative the other middle schools are in your region. We've been pretty fortunate in our area in being able to participate in the OCC as a guest member, but I've noted that in some areas the sanctioned middle schools will not schedule an unsanctioned opponent (could be that the added administrative headaches aren't deemed worth the effort).
Unsanctioned sports are also less likely to get recognition (scholar athlete, etc) or consideration in scheduling (band concerts, getting out early to travel to a game, etc) from the school. Additionally unsanctioned teams tend to need to provide their own transportation.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
Thank you for responses, information was helpful. ?Guess I am a little suprised that a MS coach and AD are more concerned with winning than being fair to the other players (8 graders) on team.
Thank you for responses, information was helpful. ?Guess I am a little suprised that a MS coach and AD are more concerned with winning than being fair to the other players (8 graders) on team.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
I agree with Ringer. Our 7th grade team is a successfull club ball team that plays other club teams as well as school santioned teams. We're not limited to the number of games we play and we have volunteer coaches whose only reason for being there is because they are qualified and they want to be there. We don't have to have a coach that's a teacher wanting to pick up a few extra $$ but knows nothing about the game (which is what happens in our other Jr. high sports and they suffer terribly from unqualified coaches since teachers get first dibs on coaching positions). We've played those team with the teacher/coaches - some are very qualified, but many are not and it's sad to see the potential talent on the teams with coaches who don't have a clue even this late in the season. It happened in our game last night - they're up to bat, runners on 1 & 2, 1 out. Catcher drops third strike, coach screams at girl to run to first and she does (not realizing that she can't) and of course the runners on 1 & 2 take off to 2 & 3. Our catcher threw the ball to third, who tagged that runner and got the out at 3 - the coach looked stunned and had to ask the umpire what was going on. Honestly, I'm surprised the ump knew the answer, but that's another issue.
Yes, we have to provide our own transportation - luckily the coaches all have vans, SUV, or large trucks and can get all the girls and their equipment in. We also have to provide our own uniforms and umpire fees - that's what fundraisers are for. I hope our Jr. high program never becomes sanctioned - I believe it's in the best interest of the girls and the sport to keep it this way.
I agree with Ringer. Our 7th grade team is a successfull club ball team that plays other club teams as well as school santioned teams. We're not limited to the number of games we play and we have volunteer coaches whose only reason for being there is because they are qualified and they want to be there. We don't have to have a coach that's a teacher wanting to pick up a few extra $$ but knows nothing about the game (which is what happens in our other Jr. high sports and they suffer terribly from unqualified coaches since teachers get first dibs on coaching positions). We've played those team with the teacher/coaches - some are very qualified, but many are not and it's sad to see the potential talent on the teams with coaches who don't have a clue even this late in the season. It happened in our game last night - they're up to bat, runners on 1 & 2, 1 out. Catcher drops third strike, coach screams at girl to run to first and she does (not realizing that she can't) and of course the runners on 1 & 2 take off to 2 & 3. Our catcher threw the ball to third, who tagged that runner and got the out at 3 - the coach looked stunned and had to ask the umpire what was going on. Honestly, I'm surprised the ump knew the answer, but that's another issue.
Yes, we have to provide our own transportation - luckily the coaches all have vans, SUV, or large trucks and can get all the girls and their equipment in. We also have to provide our own uniforms and umpire fees - that's what fundraisers are for. I hope our Jr. high program never becomes sanctioned - I believe it's in the best interest of the girls and the sport to keep it this way.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
This is our second year of dd being on a school sponsered MS team. We are very lucky to have an incredibly competent non-teacher, non-parent coach who has grown our program in the short time he's been here. We have a very supportive AD who has been at every home game & our principal, asst principal and some teachers have also attended games to root for our girls. We have all the proper equipment (and some nice extras) and everything is perfect condition. We have access to indoor facilities when the weather is bad, reliable transporation for our girls and the support of our high school program. It's also cool to have the support of our bus drivers on the away games. They are in the stands cheering along with the parents. In fact, when dd went yard, the bus driver was right there giving out high fives. Something small, but dd thought it was very cool.
I can't compare our experience to that of a club situation since all we've ever known is sanctioned, but all the positive things our school has contributed to this group of girls far outweighs the few minor inconvieiences of following the OHSAA.
This is our second year of dd being on a school sponsered MS team. We are very lucky to have an incredibly competent non-teacher, non-parent coach who has grown our program in the short time he's been here. We have a very supportive AD who has been at every home game & our principal, asst principal and some teachers have also attended games to root for our girls. We have all the proper equipment (and some nice extras) and everything is perfect condition. We have access to indoor facilities when the weather is bad, reliable transporation for our girls and the support of our high school program. It's also cool to have the support of our bus drivers on the away games. They are in the stands cheering along with the parents. In fact, when dd went yard, the bus driver was right there giving out high fives. Something small, but dd thought it was very cool.
I can't compare our experience to that of a club situation since all we've ever known is sanctioned, but all the positive things our school has contributed to this group of girls far outweighs the few minor inconvieiences of following the OHSAA.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
Warriers,
You are very lucky to be in a school district where (at least at the Jr. high level) teachers are not offered the coaching jobs first (or if they are, no teachers want them).
In our district, and many others, the teachers get the first option at the coaching positions and if they don't want them, they are up for grabs. If that were not the case, it would be great to be a school sanctioned team, but as long as teachers get the first option at coaching positions (whether they are qualified or not), I'm all in favor of the club ball option. It may not always be perfect, but it's better than the alternative.
We also have excellent equipment (top quality catchers gear, bats as well as training equipments mostly owned by the coaching staff). The only problem some will say we have is that yes, the coaches have kids on the team. However, these coaches kids are not guaranteed positions or playing time and they have all taken their turn on the bench in order to give all kids fair playing time. It doesn't matter if we're winning or losing, part way through the game, the non-starters are going in for the starters - sometimes in the in-field, sometimes in the outfield - it just depends on the players on the bench. Of course they want to win, but as coaches, they are also trying to develop all of the girls. If you only play 9 all the time, how many kids will they have come back next year?
Nothing is perfect and I'm sure there are the usual parents who don't feel their little Suzy is not getting enough playing time, but most of them probably don't know what little Suzy is up to when mom and dad aren't around. Note to parents - If you don't believe your Suzy is getting enough playing time, talk to the head coach - don't complain to everybody that will listen, don't sit in the bleachers and scream about the other kids who made a mistake, don't tell your little Suzy that she should have been in the game instead of "so & so", etc. That only creates animosity between the girls (inlcuding your Suzy because you know she is telling her teamates what mom/dad said). In talking to the coach, you may also discover that Suzy has told the coach that she doesn't want to play (insert position here), or that she only wants to play (insert position here), or maybe she complains excessively about one thing or another (stomach aches, headaches, sore arms, sore shoulders, sore ankles,etc....). You may be surprised.
Oh well, I'm stepping down off my soapbox now....
Middleschool/Jr. High programs are great, regardless of how they're organized. Whether it be school sanctioned or club - it's a great opportunity for a lot of kids to get some playing time in the spring.
Warriers,
You are very lucky to be in a school district where (at least at the Jr. high level) teachers are not offered the coaching jobs first (or if they are, no teachers want them).
In our district, and many others, the teachers get the first option at the coaching positions and if they don't want them, they are up for grabs. If that were not the case, it would be great to be a school sanctioned team, but as long as teachers get the first option at coaching positions (whether they are qualified or not), I'm all in favor of the club ball option. It may not always be perfect, but it's better than the alternative.
We also have excellent equipment (top quality catchers gear, bats as well as training equipments mostly owned by the coaching staff). The only problem some will say we have is that yes, the coaches have kids on the team. However, these coaches kids are not guaranteed positions or playing time and they have all taken their turn on the bench in order to give all kids fair playing time. It doesn't matter if we're winning or losing, part way through the game, the non-starters are going in for the starters - sometimes in the in-field, sometimes in the outfield - it just depends on the players on the bench. Of course they want to win, but as coaches, they are also trying to develop all of the girls. If you only play 9 all the time, how many kids will they have come back next year?
Nothing is perfect and I'm sure there are the usual parents who don't feel their little Suzy is not getting enough playing time, but most of them probably don't know what little Suzy is up to when mom and dad aren't around. Note to parents - If you don't believe your Suzy is getting enough playing time, talk to the head coach - don't complain to everybody that will listen, don't sit in the bleachers and scream about the other kids who made a mistake, don't tell your little Suzy that she should have been in the game instead of "so & so", etc. That only creates animosity between the girls (inlcuding your Suzy because you know she is telling her teamates what mom/dad said). In talking to the coach, you may also discover that Suzy has told the coach that she doesn't want to play (insert position here), or that she only wants to play (insert position here), or maybe she complains excessively about one thing or another (stomach aches, headaches, sore arms, sore shoulders, sore ankles,etc....). You may be surprised.
Oh well, I'm stepping down off my soapbox now....
Middleschool/Jr. High programs are great, regardless of how they're organized. Whether it be school sanctioned or club - it's a great opportunity for a lot of kids to get some playing time in the spring.
default
Member
Re: MS 7th graders playing on 7th and 8th grade te
crm, you hit the ball over the fence.
After running the books for my DD's team, some parents would find it interesting of what goes in in the dugout. There's lots of, "I dont deserve to sit," to "i cant play outfield because of my allergies." I'm not saying that kind of shenanigans dont happen in travel, but....
for some of the stronger players, they really got after the subs whenever they made a mistake, but whenever an infielder (all travel girls) made an error or struckout, they didn't say a word. Hopefully the girls realize they need to pick one another up instead of picking on a very few. They surely didn't do that in travel ball, although I've heard some stories about girls getting after one another in 12's/14's...leadership or poor sportsmanship?
okay crm, I'm off the soapbox now too...hehe
crm, you hit the ball over the fence.
After running the books for my DD's team, some parents would find it interesting of what goes in in the dugout. There's lots of, "I dont deserve to sit," to "i cant play outfield because of my allergies." I'm not saying that kind of shenanigans dont happen in travel, but....
for some of the stronger players, they really got after the subs whenever they made a mistake, but whenever an infielder (all travel girls) made an error or struckout, they didn't say a word. Hopefully the girls realize they need to pick one another up instead of picking on a very few. They surely didn't do that in travel ball, although I've heard some stories about girls getting after one another in 12's/14's...leadership or poor sportsmanship?
okay crm, I'm off the soapbox now too...hehe
Similar threads
Pitching and Pitchers Discussion
Pitching Distance for 7th/8th Graders
- Tourn_Director
- Pitching, Hitting, Catching and Fielding
- ccdteacher
- Coaching Softball Discussions