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The D1 Ohio schools bring these upper tier west coast players to Ohio and put them on teams with lesser caliber Ohio players who drag them down. Thats why none of them want to come to Ohio.
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First, this is a really good discussion. I find it interesting because I don't know if it would have been so objective if it took place five years ago. Our exposure to softball across the country has improved. We, in Ohio, are recognizing that we need and can do more to help our daughters improve. I think that it is great. We are not so defensive and we are willing to listen and change to help our daughters.
Sammy, good post. I had to do a reread to make sure it wasn't Big Train.
Pickle, A bit long for 4:00 AM but well thought out for that hour.
jb, agree 100% about level of committment.
a1sdad, I agree about the combination of players, coaches, and parents. If one area falters then so will the team.
Hopefully, after everyone comes back from Nationals, we can share more thoughts on what we learned.
Sammy, good post. I had to do a reread to make sure it wasn't Big Train.
Pickle, A bit long for 4:00 AM but well thought out for that hour.
jb, agree 100% about level of committment.
a1sdad, I agree about the combination of players, coaches, and parents. If one area falters then so will the team.
Hopefully, after everyone comes back from Nationals, we can share more thoughts on what we learned.
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Sammy hit it on the head. Read Bigtrain post on J J , since this same topic is being discussed. Parents in Ohio also don't want to pay the expenses at 12U where it needs to start. Plus coaches in Ohio are behind the times in training. Slammers , Ohio Wave and other are working to train kids and coaches by bringing in the best , yet many don't take the time to learn these new ideas. Hitting we are way behind,, and Hitter ought to know. Defense and throwing , ask Rich with the Ohio wave what Kobato says about our kids. I don't think the parents are willing to put 12 months into softball. 11 years ago I ran into my first team in Akron from Southern Calf. Got to talk to the coach and some of the parents . They play 12 months and play no other sport. They were also willing to pay a large amount of money up front for the kids to be on the team. This was used for training, not team expenses. These 12U kids cleaned house , then they told me the were just an average team . To say the least they were much better than any team playing in Akron. .
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Lady Knights, I'm not saying the Ohio universities are bringing in the top tier CA players. In my opinion they are getting 2nd and 3rd tier players. If the CA players are that good, why would they leave CA for a midwest school where the temperature is freezing 5 months out of the year? What is the advantage for a CA player to come to a midwest university? It's because they are not recruited in CA. They come to the midwest where CA in their address gets them a better look and they use the myth that they are faster, stronger, and play better defense than a midwest athlete. I have a hard time cheering for a midwest team winning less than half their games with 3/4 of their roster from CA. As you can guess I am not a CA softball fan and am a true fan of midwest softball. I really would like to see the best 12 high school players from Ohio take on the best 12 from CA. I think the game could go either way.
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I don't see the D1 coaching in the Midwest being the caliber of the West coast either. It all starts at the top.
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I'm sure this has already been answered this way already but they play year round (great wheather) more participation, it's a numbers game just like anything else. The greater the number of participants the more talent you're going to come across, and of course that means better competition which sort of compounds.
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pickledad said:Thanks BlueDevilDad ... is that "Springfield" Blue Devils? I am a Perrysburg grad, um, going back a "few" years. Good to see such hot competition in the NLL (is it still the NLL?).
Good points a1sdad, lots of commitment, dedication, and $$$ to get there. To prepare for our trip, aside from the travel monies for families to Cali, we played a preparatory 24 month HEAVY travel schedule (lots of hotels, gas, meals for 24 months), year round training (hitting instructor fees, indoor facility fees, camps), ... and oh the "time" factors ......
It truly is a lot more than just simply ability and nice weather, true. Desire, commitment, sacrifice .....
Man, I am getting close to talking myself out of doing this any more ... ?
Yes, it is Holland Springfield and yes itis still the N.L.L. And yes it is in my opinion one of the top HS leagues in the state when it come to softball.
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I had a conversation with a couple of California player's parents this past February, and discovered an interesting viewpoint. The main reason there are so many California players on eastern and midwest U.S. rosters is simply supply and demand. There are FAR more softball scholarships available in the eastern and mid-western U.S. as compared to California and the west. With the sheer number of softball players in California, only the cream goes to the PAC 10. The western U.S. just doesn't have the number of conferences that support softball. Just count the number of conferences/leagues in Ohio and surrounding states. NCAA DI & DII and NAIA schools are numerous, and DIII schools will make it happen if you're serious. Now count them out west. After the PAC 10, they fall off dramatically.
It's not that the Ohio coaches are recruiting the California players. It's more like the California players are contacting the Ohio coaches and voicing their desire to play here and take advantage of the academic opportunity. Why else would a California kid leave that climate to play college softball in Michigan - IN THE SNOW??
That's my argument for how much EASIER it is for Ohio girls to get athletic scholarships!! If you're a decent athlete (first order of business), have a true love of softball, and are willing to do QUALITY training, you have a VERY HIGH probability of an athletic scholarship!! It's a simple formula that is well within the grasp of MANY Ohio girls.
It's not that the Ohio coaches are recruiting the California players. It's more like the California players are contacting the Ohio coaches and voicing their desire to play here and take advantage of the academic opportunity. Why else would a California kid leave that climate to play college softball in Michigan - IN THE SNOW??
That's my argument for how much EASIER it is for Ohio girls to get athletic scholarships!! If you're a decent athlete (first order of business), have a true love of softball, and are willing to do QUALITY training, you have a VERY HIGH probability of an athletic scholarship!! It's a simple formula that is well within the grasp of MANY Ohio girls.
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In the 2000 Census there were more than 3 times as many girls ages 10 to 18 in California than there were in Ohio. It is likely that it is more like 4 times as many now.
Gives them quite a pool to develop from with year round practice and play versus the best competition. Like Sammy said, they can't all play in the PAC 10 so those that can't, head east.
2000 girls 10-18
Ohio - 721,615
Cali -2,196,959
Orange County - 174,365
Gives them quite a pool to develop from with year round practice and play versus the best competition. Like Sammy said, they can't all play in the PAC 10 so those that can't, head east.
2000 girls 10-18
Ohio - 721,615
Cali -2,196,959
Orange County - 174,365
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I'm really bored so I dragged up a couple of old posts that were interesting...lol.
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I wonder if they have the same restrictions when it comes to school ball ?
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At 50 team showcase in Indy with 25 college coaches in attendance...Crystl ask the kids who practiced off the tee 6 times last week, 5,4,3,2 one girl raised her hand and then CB asked was it at practice or own your own? 1 was at practice 1 was on my own and 7 girls raised their hand at 1 and all was from a practice. She made the statement to the parents and players, "You knew you were coming to a showcase that would have college coaches and you did nothing to prepare! and "Why did you waste two days for gas, food and hotels and spend 300 to $400 dollars for a bat?
At the Hawks clinic over the weekend several parents ask what it takes to become a better hitter so I asked the same question to their kids and not one of them practice on their own! I asked if they had an area set up to practice in and they all said yes. However the parents are the ones who soft toss and put the ball on the tee and I asked you mean to say you can not put a ball on the tee yourself and hit it?
I made the statement to the girl, if you were having problems with math would you put the math book under your pillow and sleep on it and think you would be smarter in the morning? No! So why not just sleep with your bat under your pillow and think you would become a better hitter? You have to actually use it and practice. CB said her team practiced in California once a week...from 9 to 5 on Sundays and someone would get pizza or make sandwiches and you were expected to work on your own with anything you had problems with at practice during the week.
Someone mentioned about the quality of coaching in the area as to colleges and what they teach...I only know of one who "upgraded" and that was Coach Larabee going to the SEC.
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Sheer numbers, better training, better weather. Softball is also VERY popular out west and attracts some of their best athletes. I`d say softball in Ohio might be 3rd behind volleyball and basketball. Then there is s####r that thins the heard even more.
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soccwer takes moer of the softball athletes than you give it credit for
smaller kids, very good athletes who run well go play ****** because its funner because theres more action and better coaching then softball
whats softball left with
wish bigtrain could talk about this one -- who knows bbetter
smaller kids, very good athletes who run well go play ****** because its funner because theres more action and better coaching then softball
whats softball left with
wish bigtrain could talk about this one -- who knows bbetter
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I agree with Punchout Volleyball and Basketball take more of the athletes. Welcome a board Punchout, I assume you chose not to pay the $12.00. Lol.....
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Learning by OSMOSIS.... I tried that in college and my freshman year proved me wrong...that the book sitting on my forehead the "stuff" didn't jump into my head. Had to work it...
If "this stuff" was easy we'd all do it...and "if common sense was so common why don't more of us have it?" Had to throw that it in there.
It took most of our girls 8-12 months or more to "start" getting "some of it" and we all coach it the same way on my team. The ones that got it or are getting it quicker are working 15+ minutes a day 4-6 times a week and their parents never ask them or push them to work (only a couple do this and the teams know who they are). We still have a ways to go but it's working. It's a marathon and we are extremely happy that is working.
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Les I totally agree they need to work more on their own and be encouraged to do so and not threatened to do it however the basic skills of leverage, balance, throwing, grip is not taught or explained well to the girls and must be a right of passage for the boys
Those that were at the Saturday Hawks clinic saw us use the hammer device....I have always believed the girls are behind the power curve when it comes to throwing, balance, leverage and how to grip a bat or hammer.
So I stated teaching it at the garage...I ask one of the girls if I could lift her with one hand and she said no way! I got a 2 x 4 and a small piece of wood and her stand on the end and with two fingers I pushed down on the board and up she went! Is the bat a lever? Yes in my mind it is and how we hold that lever makes a difference.
I took the hammer device, a gas operated shock and pushed it downward and ask her to pound it with a hammer and try to keep it down and it was too funny! She was standing up on her toes and using her entire arm trying to hit the nail (actually a shock from a car) and I had to stop her I was laughing so hard! Then I said hold it like we do the bat and do not let the thumb hold over on top of the index finger, get the elbow a little higher and remember the elbow moves like a hinge (what's a hinge?) you can not make stuff like this up! It is what holds a door and allows it to move so it will close or open like a book (Oh! Those things!) Now look at your wrist does it move like a hinge? (Yes!) Now lets try it again and she got it and started hitting it harder and more accurately. We kept telling her to raise her elbow a little more and do not be afraid to miss or make a mistake and then we did it left handed! (Even funnier) However she did it!
I took a piece of plastic wrap and tied it onto her index finger of the top hand like a ring, in front of the pad on her palm so the bat would stay in front of it and she could feel it. This kept it out of the back of her hand and the next ball she hit you could hear the difference! I encouraged her to hit the ball harder and use her wrist like she was hitting the nail device and she took off on her own.
The Lady from Softball The Magazine was watching and I encouraged her to try it...she plays slow pitch and had a good swing. We instructed her how to do it both left and right handed and then she hit again and you could see and hear the difference and she said this is a great way to explain it. She wanted to know why we did not just use nails and a piece of wood? I told her using nails would probably create a safety issue as the nails could come out if not started properly or hit squarely which is why I made the nailer device. At home you could try this by putting a 2 x 4 into a vise side ways (nail into the edge verses the flat) and start the nail (16 p) about a half inch and have the hitter wear safety glasses. If the hitter is not tall enough I use a stool.
You said in college you placed the book on your forehead...is that why it is so flat?
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You had a team that was competing at the So-Cal level. But let them fall apart. Get your tails in gear, get that team back together and you may just get a foot in the door for the rest of the Ohio teams. Not only to learn how it's done in California but just maybe start to compete out there.
John
John
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We let the team fall apart ? the team had INTERNAL problems --no need to dig at the rest of us outside of what was "slammer nation" . Trust me our tails are in gear --at full speed. MD
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I wonder how much raw population is a factor. I would guess almost all of the rural Ohio schools need the girls to play all sports just to field a team in each sport. A lot of girls aren't forced to dedicate to one discipline in MS or HS. They go from softball to volleyball to basketball just because lack of athletes in the school system. If they didn't play all three the school wouldn't have a team.
