Disputing a call...has it every worked for you?

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Every weekend there is always atleast one game our team is involved in where a coach or parent from the other team starts heckling the umpire over calls. I won't tolerate it from our team, honestly because I used to do it, and grew out of it. I am realistic and I am sure you may hear a chirp or 2 from our side of the diamond, but if I catch it I "squash it." The last time I gave the umpire grief for a call, I had the same umpire for the following game...not a fun experience. I have never had an umpire change their call when I questioned it. I also had to fill-in to umpire games, and gained a whole new respect for them. Umpires are human they don't always get everything right and I always explain to our players and parents. It is a part of the game and play it as its called.
This weekend, I started walking toward the umpire, and he shooed me away! I wasnt upset I just wanted to understand why he called, what he did. The same umpire called the game on time limit and due to pressure from the opposing team and made us play another inning because there was "30 seconds left in the game." The outcome of the game did not change, but I was a little puzzled. I am still working to gracefully question a call, but for now I just grin and bear it.
So back to my questions, has disputing a call ever worked for you?

 

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Yes.

 

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Yes

 

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If we have just one umpire, not usually. Unless its a "rules" call. Like, perhaps the umpired didn't call in-field fly rule or something like that. However, we had a couple occasions this weekend where we were able to appeal the call to the base umpire and got the original call overturned. I am not one to argue with a call either. I might blurt out the occassional "come on, blue!" right after a call I didn't agree with, but then I drop it and move onto the next one.
With that said, our last home plate umpire in the championship game yesterday made a complete a$$ of himself when questioned during our game. Both pitchers struggled in the first inning finding his strikezone. It just seemed like he would not call anything that wasn't down the pipe. So, in between inning (so to not interrupt play), our coach calmly asked the umpire where his strikezone was so our pitcher could make the needed adjustments. The umpire flew off the handle and made a big production about the whole thing. Which goes to show that he had probably been questioned about his strikezone all day long.

 

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I guess I am no savvy in this area, do you have suggestions?

 

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Both pitchers struggled in the first inning finding his strikezone. It just seemed like he would not call anything that wasn't down the pipe. So, in between inning (so to not interrupt play), our coach calmly asked the umpire where his strikezone was so our pitcher could make the needed adjustments. The umpire flew off the handle and made a big production about the whole thing. Which goes to show that he had probably been questioned about his strikezone all day long.

I have had some issues with zones this year, but I chalk that up to the tournaments where the umpires have 6 games in a row with no more than a 15 minute break. I am not sure I could find the zone crouching down behind 10u players all day either.

 

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Oh, I agree whole heartedly. That was one of the main issues with the tournament we were in this weekend. On Saturday, they only had one umpire assigned to each game for our age group. But that umpire did all 6 games scheduled for that diamond. Same thing on Sunday, but atleast they did have a base umpire for bracket play. Our last umpire on Saturday actually told the coaches in the pre-game meeting to please bear with him as he was completely exhausted after doing 5 games in a row. I don't understand the reasoning behind the umpire scheduling, but on hot days like it was Saturday, it is rediculous to not give the umpires a game or two break throughout the day.

 

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Yes. It was a group effort. The batter was called out and she then asked the plate umpire if she was called out on the pitch or the swing. Blue said, "swing". Then, her coach asked permission for help from the base umpire who then said, "she didn't go". I think the key to having a call overturned is one word. Respect. I can't recall the last time a call was overturned because someone was a jackwagon.

 

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Sure it can work for you especially if one of them isn't in the correct position. You don't argue about it, you respectfully ask them to conference with their partner to ensure they are seeing the same thing. Haveseen many turned around in both Travel and H.S games.

Key word is "Respectfully" ask

 

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As suggested above, it's usually only going to work when there's a second ump who either understands the rule better or, what more often happens, had a better view of the play. The key is calmly asking time to talk to the ump who made the call and, as CGS noted in another recent thread, asking them what they saw. So let's say there was a close play at a base, and the ump says I saw that the throw beat the runner ... but let's say that you saw that the ball was juggled or that the defensive player's foot was off the bag ... and perhaps the ump who made the call may not have had a good view on that, in which case you ask if they would be so kind as to check with their partner. I would say that I/we have averaged 1-2 calls overturned a year for this kind of situation. There probably should have been a lot more, but occasionally the ump will refuse to ask the other for help (I hate when they do that when you have a legitimate case like this), and at other times the other ump just didn't see it either.

 

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Sure it can work for you especially if one of them isn't in the correct position. You don't argue about it, you respectfully ask them to conference with their partner to ensure they are seeing the same thing. Haveseen many turned around in both Travel and H.S games.

Key word is "Respectfully" ask

+_1

 

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Had an issue in Toledo this past weekend that I calmly tried to get some consideration on and neither ump saw it my way, but they did seem receptive to my asking. Opposing coach was arguing the opposite and got shut down immediately.

Situation: Bunt down 3rd baseline, scooped by F5 and thrown over the head of F3 who jumped, didn't catch the ball and came down straddled across the single bag when there was a collision. Ball carried down the fence into semi-deep right field. My runner is laid out just past first base and would of had 2nd easily if F3 wasn't blocking the bag.

I asked for consideration that my runner was obstructed by F3 and asked for an award of 2nd. The opposing coach was arguing interference on my batter/runner, where he got that I have no idea. Ump(s) ruled the contact as "part of the game" and we continued.

 

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Sounds like a bad call. Did your runner go out of her way to contact the fielder, or was she simply running right at the base? If the latter,then this sounds like textbook obstruction.

Blocking a runner's access to the base and knocking her down is NOT "just a part of the game"!

 

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She was running straight for the base, it was a single bag and F3 came down from her leap straddling it. I made my plea and the opposing coach was screaming for interference. I was amazed that he was pushing for that considering the ball was already on the ground in shallow right before the contact.

The final straw that made me just pack our girls up and leave was even more cut and dry: runners on 2nd & 3rd and their batter hits a sharp grounder to our F5 who immediately throws home and our catcher is three feet up the line in position with the ball. Runner is two feet outside of the baseline in foul territory on her path to home going for the back of the plate. Our catcher has her blocked, the girls is dead-meat. She then changes direction into fair territory easily three feet inside the line and avoids my lunging catcher. I made a respectful appeal that she deviated from her path by more than 3' to avoid the tag and the umpire looked me straight in the eye and said "that was no more than 1' ". My catcher is 5'9" and lunging couldn't reach her and it was only 1'. I could go on and on about this past weekend, but it will only give me ulcers. LoL

 

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The final straw that made me just pack our girls up and leave was even more cut and dry

Are you saying that you left without completing your assigned games because of a bad call?

 

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Many times!!!

 

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Yes.

 

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Not even close to as many that should have been.

 

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Not even close to as many that should have been.

True dat.

 

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Maybe this isn't the place but just want the softball world know that at the Urbana Classic (NSA) this past weekend , it was the worst umpiring I have ever experienced in 8 years in this game. At the 12u, I dont believe we had one ump under 60 years old. Not that there is anything wrong with this, I will never discriminate against age or anything else. These gentlemen were required to do 6 games straight on Saturday and by the 4th game they were spent. Terrible calls, sportsmanship, and knowledge of rules. I know of a few coaches that got thrown out from questioning calls. Yes all coaches were aggravated from the crew and might have been alittle overboard, but through my experience, these gentlemen talked down to us coaches with no respect and were there strickly for the money and didnt even give a cr@p about the girls. One of our games the field ump didnt show up til the 3rd inning and another game we had a 20 minute delay cause one ump was sick. Well when you smell like alcohol and your in the heat of course you will get sick. Then on top of the umpiring never knew a tournament had no grounds crew. A 3 hour rain delay and then the coaches had to prep the fields if we wanted to play. Needless to say that no towels or tp in the restrooms all weekend. No food at the concessions stand on Sunday neither. They ran out of everything. We took second and earned a birth but we will never go back to the Urbana Classic.