Opinions on different bracket arrangements.

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I would like to hear different opinions from different sources (coaches, parents, players and TD's) regarding bracket's for tournaments. Specifically good and bad thoughts and experiences with 12 team, four game guarantee, single elimination on Sunday set ups.

I have looked at different ways of setting up the bracket and have gotten all different opinions from with in (the organization hosting). I'm curious what other have to say.

Thanks in advance!

 

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Assuming there is a game pool play format on Saturday, one format that has worked well is to divide the team into a Gold Division and put the top 8 teams from Saturday's play into it and take the bottom 4 teams and put them in a Silver Division. Makes bracketing a lot easier.
I have found the best way to do something like this is to make 2 6 team pools and while everyone does not play everyone in the pool, the 3 games do a very good job of seeding the teams 1 thru 6 in each pool--- like in other pool/round robin, you will need tiebreakers.


Now, if you want all 12 teams in the single elim, and you have 3 pools of 4 each, then bracketing becomes more subjective on which pool gets 1, 2 or 3 seeds, etc

 

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I personally do not like the whole Gold / Silver Division setup.

" We came in 1st place Silver Division ! :yahoo: "

5th place

JMHO

 

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Or, they call the divisions Platinum and Gold, and then a team can tell people they won the Gold division. I think most would assume Gold to be the highest, and therefore think they were the top dog at that tournament. :lmao:

 

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I recall a tourney last year where there were 12 teams in the age group, and they were split evenly for bracket play into Platinum and Gold. So, realistically the winner of the Gold bracket was 7th place.

I don't even necessarily mind doing it that way, but let's look at it for what it really is.

 

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My only problem with divisions based on pool play is that it forces teams to play pool games differently. I always felt that pool games were the opportunity to allow backups an opportunity to show their stuff and compete for my time. Then on Sunday you went with your best to win the championship. With this set up you must play to win pool games. It makes it tough on players 10-12 on your roster and these are players that are very important to a successful team.

 

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I actually prefer double elimination tournaments.

Have 4 team "pools" that are bracketed out. Then seed into a double elimination tournament. I would have to see how many more games it works out. But it should be about the same with the 4 game guarantee.

I get tired of the pool play into single elimination stuff.

 

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I actually prefer double elimination tournaments.

Have 4 team "pools" that are bracketed out. Then seed into a double elimination tournament. I would have to see how many more games it works out. But it should be about the same with the 4 game guarantee.
I get tired of the pool play into single elimination stuff.

3 pool + single elim = 29 games for 12 teams
2 pool + double elim = 34-35 games

You also have to consider the extra time double elim takes because there are so many rounds of games. If you have 4 fields, single elim takes 4 rounds and double elim takes 9. For 2 fields, single elim takes 6 rounds and double elim takes 13.

 

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My only problem with divisions based on pool play is that it forces teams to play pool games differently. I always felt that pool games were the opportunity to allow backups an opportunity to show their stuff and compete for my time. Then on Sunday you went with your best to win the championship. With this set up you must play to win pool games. It makes it tough on players 10-12 on your roster and these are players that are very important to a successful team.

I thought that was what practices and friendlies were for. My opinion, every game is important.

 

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For 3 pool games with 12 teams, I like 4 pools of 3 with teams playing another pool instead of their own (i.e. A vs B and C vs D). You don't get to play teams in your pool head-to-head, but everyone in a pool plays the same opponents (unlike 2 pools of 6). The big advantage is seeding the teams into the elim brackets. It also allows you to easily break the bottom 4 teams into a second bracket.

 

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As a parent/ex coach. I prefer double elimination. There is something so much more with teams that have the ability of working past a bad draw. JMHO

 

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I thought that was what practices and friendlies were for. My opinion, every game is important.

Don't want to hijack the thread too much so I will just say that I guess we will have to agree to disagree, because I think you will have a tough time putting together a high quality team with solid backups and girls being asked to play different positions then they believe are their best if you are only going to let them play or have a chance at their desired position in practice and friendlies for hundreds of dollars to cover team fees and travel costs.

 

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Don't want to hijack the thread too much so I will just say that I guess we will have to agree to disagree, because I think you will have a tough time putting together a high quality team with solid backups and girls being asked to play different positions then they believe are their best if you are only going to let them play or have a chance at their desired position in practice and friendlies for hundreds of dollars to cover team fees and travel costs.

Trust me, it can be done, and has been done in many cases. Like you say though, we can just agree to disagree on this one.

 

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There has to be consideration of the age group as well as to the final decision.

One other format is to start the teams in double elimination and then take the 0-2 and 1-2 teams and put them in a "consolation" or "Friendly" type tournament where prizes are awarded. In a way, it becomes another event. This might not work for 18U teams, because the girls are generally pretty savvy about the best teams and once beaten twice, they want to go back to their cars, boyfriends, etc

 

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Double elimination is definitely more exciting.

Otherwise, what is wrong with a first round bye to the top four teams. Eight remaining teams play round one then the four winners play the four bye teams and it all works out.

I agree too regarding the platinum, gold, and silver divisions. It's a bit too feel good for me.

 

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I personally do not like the whole Gold / Silver Division setup.

I agree.. 2 years ago we went 0-3 in pool play on Saturday and then 4-0 on Sunday to come back and win the tourney .. had it been split we would have been the 'silver' winner!

 

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One other format is to start the teams in double elimination and then take the 0-2 and 1-2 teams and put them in a "consolation" or "Friendly" type tournament where prizes are awarded.

Sounds too much like sokker! 0-2 on Sunday means they can get back at their home field by 2pm for practice!

 

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Let me put another vote in for the double elimination bracket.

 

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Double elimination is just way better but you have to commit to 3 days. You would need to do at least 1 game on a Friday. And the Saturday would be 3-4 games/rounds. To make it to Sunday for 3-4 more rounds. But I enjoy it more.

With that said. I have been to 3-4 double elimination tournaments and I can not think of one time a team from the loser bracket made it back around to the top 4. It seems th etop 4 from the champ side make it all back around. So some could argue that nothing changes. But I still like the opportunites to dream. And the girls are more into it IMO.

 

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I prefer double elimination as well, but there just doesn't seem to be many tournaments out there that do it.

Dayton Metro and Lasers are two good ones that come to mind that have DE. Isn't GAPSS that way as well?