Earned runs?

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Top of the inning, 1st and 2nd batter to the plate strike out. ?Third batter hits one through the SS legs for an error. ?Next 3 batters hit home runs. ?7th batter in the inning strikes out. ?How many earned runs are recorded?

 

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Zip. Zero. Zilch.

 

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That would be correct.

 

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We (my husband and myself) are relatively new to fastpitch, would you please explain the answer.

 

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If there was not an error, the pitcher would have been out of the inning; or put another way, without the error the next batters would not have come up and those runs would not have existed.

 

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When calculating earned runs, you are to re-construct the inning as if the errors never happened. Take away the error on the SS and this inning should be over, thus none of the runs scored after that point are considered "earned ".

Here are two sources for scoring guidelines that should answer just about any scoring question you will ever have.

ATEC Scoring Guidelines:

http://nfca.org.ismmedia.com/ISM2/MultimediaManager/ATEC.pdf

NCAA Rules/Scoring (Section 14):

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2005/2005_softball_rules.pdf

 

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bretman:

Thanks for the ncaa reference. I've saved the file in the same folder as the ATEC one. I looked at the "score a hit" and "score/don't score an error" sections, since I've had cause to study those sections of ATEC recently. The two sources are about 90% the same language, but the differences are intriguing.

Both sources agree on one thing: in a close case, you err in favor of the hit. I don't think many H.S. scorers carry through on this directive.

 

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CGS,

It depends on whose dad is keeping score...........

The pitchers or the Shortstops. :-X

I agree with your statement, but scoring a game is in a lot of cases a very objective task for most who have never read the guidelines. Even with the rules its subjective to interpretation by the score keeper.

Elliott.

 

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Actual situation

1st batter - ground out
2nd batter - base hit
3rd batter - ground ball to ss, flip to 2nd for force. Ump signals out but 2nd baseman then drops the ball. Safe. Good call. Error on 2nd.
runners on 1st and 2nd, 1 out.
4th batter - base hit, run scores, runners on 1st and 2nd.
5th batter - 4 -3 ground out, runners advance to 2nd and 3rd, 2 outs.
6th batter - base hit, 2 runs score. Runner at 1st, 2 outs
7th batter - ground out

In the inning, 3 runs scored.
Coach is using new software that awards 2 earned runs

If I re-construct the inning as directed in earlier posts the most earned runs that I can come up with is 1. That would assume that batter 3 would score from 1st on the hit by batter 4.

How many earned runs would you record?

The Atec guide says that a run is unearned if a runner's life is prolonged by an error. This does open it up to interpretation. For me to go to the coach and question his formula I need something more crystal clear. Does anyone know of any documentation such as this?

 

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Scorekeeper/Turbostats is not reliable in calculating ERA's. Your coach really needs to check on each game to make sure that the earned runs have been properly calculated.

In response to complaints about this, Turbostats has maintained on its web site that there isn't a problem, but I know from first hand experience that's not true.

As for your particular example, clearly the young lady who remained on 2nd due to the error cannot be counted as an earned run. Nor could either of the runners behind her, because they were on first and second when the #5 batter hit into the 4-3 out; without the error on the dropped ball at second, the 4-3 out would have been the third out.

No earned runs. You aren't going to find any "rule" that more specifically addresses your question, but I also don't think the attribution of 0 earned runs is subject to argument. Maybe I'm missing something.

 

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cgs is right, no earned runs there. That's pretty simple, actually.

 

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Just talked to the coach who said that he would check into it. He also said that another factor in the formula is how many hits occurred after the error. That if the error occurs and then the team gets 3 or more hits afterward some earned runs are recorded. Is anyone aware of this or the origin of this idea?

 

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There is no such "rule". See the unanimity on the original question that opened this thread: three home runs in succession after an error on what would have been the third out = 0 runs.

 

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Upon further review, our coach and AD have decided that their method of calculating ERA is correct and everyone else's is wrong. Unfortunately, this is not a strong fielding team and this difference of opinion is costing the pitcher about 10 earned runs.

I know that the rules are very clear that you must re-construct the inning but I would appreciate some kind of definative documentation that sites this exact circumstance.