Hitting and Hitters Discussion Reverse Hand Swing

[straightleg]

Lenski and Bouldersdad have spelled it out. The hips are a tad in front of the hands on the start of rotation. They both have daughters that play college ball.

The swing I teach is based on RVP which is endorsed by Candera. I was Trained by Hitter on this forum. Enough said..

The drill Casey is doing is a slow motion swing. The slo motion matrix drill breaks it down to help teach hitters in slow motion first. Of course in real speed the hips and hands can come to gether, but a better swing is when there is a slight lag of bat and hands behind the hips.

Demon. Casey broke 6 high school hitting records at her school. 3 life time, 3 single season. 2 of the Single season, was the number of doubles and triples. If you are interested in making your hitter or hitters better, I would say to do more studying and watching videos on swing mechanics.
Study anything Hitter or Lenski has posted.
Also feel free to use videos I post to enhance your hitter or hitters...



SL

 

[straightleg]

Hips leading swing Still...College summer team

Home run swing high school

 

[straightleg]

Hips leading swings: Slow motion to teach, like Casey does in the drills....
Full speed swings below hips leading it is just a split second in front of the hands





SL

 

[ApogeeDemon]

That's not hip rotation. That's weight transfer. Watch the Georgia girl. She shifts her weight with her hips but again, her hands and hips and working together.

 

[ApogeeDemon]

Hips leading swing, Still...College summer team

Home run swing high school

Is that Santa Claus on the bench?

 

[ApogeeDemon]

Lenski and Bouldersdad have spelled it out. The hips are a tad in front of the hands on the start of rotation. They both have daughters that play college ball.

The swing I teach is based on RVP which is endorsed by Candera. I was Trained by Hitter on this forum. Enough said..

The drill Casey is doing is a slow motion swing. The slo motion matrix drill breaks it down to help teach hitters in slow motion first. Of course in real speed the hips and hands can come to gether, but a better swing is when there is a slight lag of bat and hands behind the hips.

Demon. Casey broke 6 high school hitting records at her school. 3 life time, 3 single season. 2 of the Single season, was the number of doubles and triples. If you are interested in making your hitter or hitters better, I would say to do more study on swing mechanics. Study anything Hitter or Lenski has posted, And fell free to use my videos I posted...



SL

What college does she play for? I'm glad she has high school records. But high school records usually don't mean much because if play sisters of the poor and our savior high schools all the time, your stats are going to look great. Plus high school coaches put hit in the book on 99% of the errors.

 

[manitoudan]

Only softball hitting guys can argue over minutia like this . Both agree hips lead the hands, over a beerId guess you guys Agree on nearly everything .
My daughter was a student of the SL / Hitter theory . She hit above 500 with a ginormous slugging % during her 4 years of HS . I'd say Brittany Duncan and her power numbers speak well . I know freshman Kayla Koch at BSU grew up with this approach . Really too many others to list . I'd say you guys are closer in theory than what you both think .

 

[BouldersDad]

Politics religion and hitting gotta love the Zealots. You have a better chance of getting struck by lightning than winning an online hitting discussion . I stopped getting in on active hitting threads a while back because its pretty much like mud wrestling a pig. Is hard dirty work and pretty soon you realize the pig is enjoying it.

I am a result oriented person so here is my opinion and my recommendation to anyone that gets caught up in a quagmire like this. Look to the results of the Instructors or persons posting. Period. It will save you a ton of grief in the long run.

MD working in that system from the age of 11 to 15 my dd had a load of success with it. Then by working on bat speed we discovered a different concept. And it increased bat speed and power significantly. Hitting evolves. The basics of what we were taught by Donny Amerine and Howard are still there at the core. With the addition of some new movements added to it I think it turned out pretty well.

Tim

 

[HITTER23]

Discussfastpitch.com deja vu......

 

[SMc4SMc]

I enjiy this site like most for the varying points of view especially when there's no mudslinging. I also have read a lot of solid informative threads that when countered seem to go down hill fast. So hopefully we continue to post/discuss with respect as well as interpret with respect because a text or post can easily be inferred incorrectly.


Finally, I would like some feedback on the correlation of hips/hands and hitters that tend to pull the ball. Front side mechanics, staying in, rotating too early or late...etc.

Thx.

 

[Hitter]

We like to use the reverse top hand drill for those that tend to roll the wrist over and hit their back or shoulder. Once they understand the feel of too and through the ball and grip they seem to acquire the feel quickly the action of the hands at contact or see it, feel it and fix it.

This is why we teach to understand balance, stance and grip and how to use a hammer first.

As to the Elvis move....we break down the swing using what we call the matrix drill. This is how martial arts is taught, one movement at a time. I will take 1,300 plus years of how martial arts is taught verses baseball and softball. The last I checked only 19.84 percent of MLB players hit over .300. So anyone who can get through to the MLB players could make their weight in gold if you could get them to change. No one wants to change what got them to the big leagues. Yet everyone has an opinion. When you work with a kid and they take it to the next level it makes me feel good and when they get some scholarship money it makes the parents feel batter also.

Kavin Morgan, whom I have worked with for about 8 years, posted on OFC that 8 of his kids have one million dollars in scholarship money both athletic and academic money and they have two more girls to sign. So does what we do work? I think so!

Ready, set, bend at the waist and soften the knees, get a good two eyed look, load, separate to touch touch, Elvis move, box, parallel to contact and through to finish keeping the head down.

Once we load and stride the weight is basically 50/50. Then we lift the back foot heel slightly rolling to the inside edge of the back foot (eversion) focusing the weight on the inside edge of the foot, focusing the weight on the big toe and toe next to it. In martial arts this is known as a hip thrust. We feel this allows the hitter to better understand how the weight gets off the back side by using the hips.

We also use a brick that has a tapered edge on it to simulate eversion. As you swing it forces the hips to turn or you can not clear the brick. Watch any MLB game and ask why they dig out the back of the batters box at an angle. To gain eversion by using the hips.

Demon you seem to ask questions that offer opinions rather than actual facts or add to ones understanding of how to teach.

You ask others to provide data...what teaching data or students do you have to offer to the conversations of what works well for many others?

Happy New Years Guys.

 

[ApogeeDemon]

We like to use the reverse top hand drill for those that tend to roll the wrist over and hit their back or shoulder. Once they understand the feel of too and through the ball and grip they seem to acquire the feel quickly the action of the hands at contact or see it, feel it and fix it.

This is why we teach to understand balance, stance and grip and how to use a hammer first.

As to the Elvis move....we break down the swing using what we call the matrix drill. This is how martial arts is taught, one movement at a time. I will take 1,300 plus years of how martial arts is taught verses baseball and softball. The last I checked only 19.84 percent of MLB players hit over .300. So anyone who can get through to the MLB players could make their weight in gold if you could get them to change. No one wants to change what got them to the big leagues. Yet everyone has an opinion. When you work with a kid and they take it to the next level it makes me feel good and when they get some scholarship money it makes the parents feel batter also.

Kavin Morgan, whom I have worked with for about 8 years, posted on OFC that 8 of his kids have one million dollars in scholarship money both athletic and academic money and they have two more girls to sign. So does what we do work? I think so!

Ready, set, bend at the waist and soften the knees, get a good two eyed look, load, separate to touch touch, Elvis move, box, parallel to contact and through to finish keeping the head down.

Once we load and stride the weight is basically 50/50. Then we lift the back foot heel slightly rolling to the inside edge of the back foot (eversion) focusing the weight on the inside edge of the foot, focusing the weight on the big toe and toe next to it. In martial arts this is known as a hip thrust. We feel this allows the hitter to better understand how the weight gets off the back side by using the hips.

We also use a brick that has a tapered edge on it to simulate eversion. As you swing it forces the hips to turn or you can not clear the brick. Watch any MLB game and ask why they dig out the back of the batters box at an angle. To gain eversion by using the hips.

Demon you seem to ask questions that offer opinions rather than actual facts or add to ones understanding of how to teach.

You ask others to provide data...what teaching data or students do you have to offer to the conversations of what works well for many others?

Happy New Years Guys.

You can't answer a question with a question. That's a diverginary tactic. Anyone can pick out 2 hitters that they worked with out of 200 that are doing well in college and say LOOK! what I'm doing works! I'm sure that many of the things you do are working. As to the "Elvis" move, we simply disagree. I think the hips are only a fraction ahead of the hands. You can see this in every MLB swing analysis I posted. I don't think it's a good idea to practice that because it over does it. Your hips shouldn't be rotated and your hands still in place. That's my opinion. I think Bouldersdad has taken the basics of the Howard Carrier swing and made it better. That's just an opinion. I can see the modifications in his daughters swing. You count money from the girls that made it. What about the girls that didn't? I know down here in the Cincy area that many of the girls (Bustos Ultimates) I think they were called and tried to use that hitting approach and many couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. Honestly, I think hitting evolves. I also think that when we do look at the best in the business, we do see trends. Here's one for you. For years we kept telling the girls to keep that back elbow down. Did you know that Pat Murphy now teaches his girls to keep their back elbow up? Don't believe me, ask him! I'm glad we are all trying to find the golden fleece. Conversations create thinking. Thinking creates new ideas. ps--still wondering what college she plays for!

 

[Hitter]

Once again you provide nothing but rhetoric.

The elbows are style not an absolute and as the hitter understands the mechanics of hitting they inject their style to their swing and if it does not work go back to the mechanics and try again.

Ask someone why Crystl dropped them if you actually know anyone who actually knows about the subject. When you put your name on something you have certain expectations on performance and teaching methods. Do not follow them and you loose support from the best female hitter in the world in my opinion. You are correct you can lead them to the water or just fall out of the boat and get wet. However that is all ancient history and you are reaching for the skies again.

There are more than 2 however you should know that as the all seeing and all knowing space orbiter of the world.

Whatever Pat does that works for him or his students works for me as it is his performance that keeps his job.

Many coaches teach differently and are successful.....again please enlighten us who or what you teach if you do at all? As coach Candrea has said it is not how you start, it is where you are when you decide if you are going to swing at the ball.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results without changing the process...Einstein.

Please expound on your ability to teach verses saying what you think works and tell us how you do it.

I would hope Tim makes the process better and makes improvements...anything less would be under him as he has always ask questions and offered advice. Why do you think Crystl ask him and Brit to work at clinics with us as many other local coaches.

Please answer some questions about the actual kids you have worked with or what you actually teach.

 

[ApogeeDemon]

Once again you provide nothing but rhetoric.

The elbows are style not an absolute and as the hitter understands the mechanics of hitting they inject their style to their swing and if it does not work go back to the mechanics and try again.

Ask someone why Crystl dropped them if you actually know anyone who actually knows about the subject. When you put your name on something you have certain expectations on performance and teaching methods. Do not follow them and you loose support from the best female hitter in the world in my opinion. You are correct you can lead them to the water or just fall out of the boat and get wet. However that is all ancient history and you are reaching for the skies again.

There are more than 2 however you should know that as the all seeing and all knowing space orbiter of the world.

Whatever Pat does that works for him or his students works for me as it is his performance that keeps his job.

Many coaches teach differently and are successful.....again please enlighten us who or what you teach if you do at all? As coach Candrea has said it is not how you start, it is where you are when you decide if you are going to swing at the ball.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results without changing the process...Einstein.

Please expound on your ability to teach verses saying what you think works and tell us how you do it.

I would hope Tim makes the process better and makes improvements...anything less would be under him as he has always ask questions and offered advice. Why do you think Crystl ask him and Brit to work at clinics with us as many other local coaches.

Please answer some questions about the actual kids you have worked with or what you actually teach.

Oh no, you pulled the Crystl Bustos card again. Its that magic Trump card. Get out of jail card. When all else fails, go to Crystl. Let me see if I have the story correct. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, I apologize. You met Crystl and told her that you knew how to make her hit the ball further. You showed her and she liked it. But the point was that she was already an elite hitter that was taught by someone else! So Instead of hitting it 350 ft, she can now hit it 375ft. Again, she was already a great hitter before you ever worked with her? Is this correct? So lets say I meet Amanda Chidester at a camp and tell her I think she can hit the ball harder by keeping her back elbow up. She agrees to this, can I claim that I'm her hitting instructor from that point on? I'm just wondering?! ps--still wondering what college.

 

[ApogeeDemon]

ps---I teach an elite, gold, platinum, select 10U team. We were corn festival champs last summer! We beat the Granola Bars 25-17! Our pitcher even had 1 strikeout! We had several homeruns (Balls kept getting caught in the corn stalks) So I know what I'm doin! Do you know what I'm doin? wait, Do you know what you are doin?

 

[Hitter]

You mock what you do not know anything about and have become the Jerry Springer of OFC in my opinion.

 

[Lenski65]

Jerry Springer of OFC.....lol. AD, heaven help you if you look like Jerry.

 

[BouldersDad]

Has anyone ever seen a hitting thread that diddnt turn into a mud slinging my dad can beat up your dad your mom is so ugly thread?

 

[wvanalmsick]

Here is a photo that I always liked. Good form, at least I think so.

She came from the Mike Larabee/Howard School of Hitting.

 

[cobb_of_fury]

Has anyone ever seen a hitting thread that diddnt turn into a mud slinging my dad can beat up your dad your mom is so ugly thread?

If you think hitting is bad, Stay as far away from the pitching threads as you can - there are factions over there that will burn you as a heretic soon as look at you.