beware of the softball snakes

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It is amazing how much effort my 00 coach put into last years team, the success they had only to have the team distroyed by the softball snake. That is the person(s) that goes around looking for talent then behind your back, steals them away. I have no problem if a girl is not happy or it's not a good fit to look elsewhere. I would only contact one that shows interest and approaches me. All I can say, we much be doing well with our instructing. Anyone can coach talent I guess. Just wanted some thoughts on this or have you been bitten too.

 

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We had a parent trying to recruit our players for another organization for 2012 during our last two tournaments AND this same parent tried to recruit tryout attendees last Saturday. All I can say is good luck to that parent's dd with her new team and organization and good luck to anyone else from our team that is stupid enough to follow.

Len
Havoc Fastpitch

 

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Would this "softball snake" be a rather large and more repitable orginization,that ..let's face it..has not really turned out anything in the past few years..except One team..Oh make that two..and the other left them? My daughter played for them one year. Trust me ,the grass is not so green on the other side. I knew by the end of that year that the coaching staff/orginazation. Was NOT going to teach my daughter really anything more to make her grow. I have a video that was shot of my daughter batting in this more repitable facility..and being instructed by this more repitable orginazation leader. He was telling her how GREAT of a swing and job she was doing..We being new into this had no idea otherwise,being newbies. She continued to decline in the batting order..going from a 4-5 slot hitter,to barely hitting at all. It only dawned on us later after we left..and after we found a "REAL" orginazation and coaching staff..who, by the way is now teaching all the other "repitable" orginazations girls how to bat..that she was batting all wrong..we compared her swings,from what we so thought was correct.. to when she began her new team, who actually uses and understands the right view pro program,night and day.. That is just one issue. I can go on and on forever. I guess what the parents have to understand is..You are looking for key things for your daughters.. 1. Great coaches 2. Are they going to get my daughter to the next level and make her grow as a player?3. Can this program get my daughter to college showcase tournoments? Lets face it people..If your daughter has the tallent and right stuff...It does not matter what orginazation she plays for. She will get noticed wherever she is..in the end it is just the name game..Who is going to get credit for your athlete?

 

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I agree to some extent that it doesn't matter what team you play for, but if your team can't get in Stingrays, won't step up and play in tourneys such as Lasers or Best of the Best..etc, and credit their winning record to tourney wins at Dixie Days and the Monster Mash tourney, kids are going to leave for better opportunities.

 

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I am not trying to be negative towards anyone, but as a coach that has to develope players and not just picking up players who are ready to play it is very frustrating to spend all your time before and after practice developing fundamentals just to see a team that may have a more reputable name take them away from you, you would just think that some where along the road there would be some respect from coach to coach to not go behind each others back, if the player approaches you that is one thing, but come on in the middle of a tournament or to be calling behind a coaches back that is low, I would just like to say I applaud all you players and coaches who may not be with a more reputable org. for keeping your eye on what is important all the girls who want and deserve a chance to play and develope as a player, if you stick together and have the coaching you can compete even if you are in a developing process, parents if you see something in your coach be patient and i am sure he/she will put together a quality team I love teaching and would not trade that for anything, its just sad that the world of softball has come to this.

 

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Happened to me and two of my players. Another organization tried to recruit them in mid-season. Thank goodness they are happy where they are and did not go. It goes on EVERYWHERE. I agree with Coach3. You work and work for years and develop your players and someone else moves in and tries to take them. We should take it as a compliment, that our instruction and their hard work paid off to the point that other teams want them, but it is just unethical and cut-throat to flat out steal players.

 

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As I said in another thread this all about the girls stuff is **** for a majority of the fastpitch world. I would not put Phil and the Diamonds in that category however.

 

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I have never ever never ever seeen anyone ever put a gun to a players head and kidnap them and make them play for their team. These "other" teams are NOT stealing your players. Your players are leaving you. It may be a shot to your ego but it's the player's choice 100% of the time if they decided to go elsewhere. Listen folks, that is the way it is. Coaches choose all the time not to invite a player back, well the player is doing to same thing, not inviting to have the coach back.

 

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I have never ever never ever seeen anyone ever put a gun to a players head and kidnap them and make them play for their team. These "other" teams are NOT stealing your players. Your players are leaving you. It may be a shot to your ego but it's the player's choice 100% of the time if they decided to go elsewhere. Listen folks, that is the way it is. Coaches choose all the time not to invite a player back, well the player is doing to same thing, not inviting to have the coach back.

While I agree that there is nobody holding a gun to their head, but there are snake oil salesman out there that convince these kids that they are offering something that they cannot get anywhere else. The sad part is that these snake oil salesman NEVER have the kids best interest at heart.

 

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So let me ask this .. we are in tryout season .. is it ok to contact a player/family on a team you saw last year and invite them to tryouts? Let them know that you are interested in having them on your team - or flat out making them an offer to join you no tryout needed?

 

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So let me ask this .. we are in tryout season .. is it ok to contact a player/family on a team you saw last year and invite them to tryouts? Let them know that you are interested in having them on your team - or flat out making them an offer to join you no tryout needed?

No problem at all. Make your offer, but do not disparage their current org. I feel that is the classy way to handle it.

I would inject; why are you offering the kid a position? Is it to better your team or to better the player? Or both? If it is only about your team or you looking better as a coach than it is always a bad thing in my opinion. If you can honestly provide an equal or better venue for the player to improve than it is a good thing. JMHO

 

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@TheRinger:

I assume your answer is a differently one in open try-out season than when season tryouts are not in session. I totally oppose a coach enticing a player to jump ship mid season, as there are a lot of other girls who get screwed by the jumping. So is that team that is now down a player supposed to keep the cycle going by grabbing another player from still lesser teams that have a few really good players? Regular season becomes a huge drama and a series of unjustifiable losses when team poaching has become rampart.

Come try-out season,coaches can go hard after whomever they want. I'd just caution the players who are being wooed by these aggressive coaches that, if the coach also has a history of trying to pick up players in season, you never know whether it is your position for which the aggressive coach will seek a pick-up.

It is just so much more of a civil world when teams put together a certain number of members for one season, make preliminary but not "hard in stone" commitments to player positions, AND make the much more important commitment, in hard stone, that the team will remain intact for the season.

 

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My opinion is that it's never OK to talk to prospective players while they're still playing with another team, because it's quite likely to end up hurting the chemistry of their current team. It is definitely OK to talk to them after the end of the season during these tryout weeks, as long as they haven't already committed to another team.

When you do talk to them, it's never OK to promise them things you don't know that you can deliver on, and its definitely OK to talk with them about what you know you can, and/or what you hope to be able to do as long as you are honest about that possibility.

There's almost nothing worse than lying to kids and it's almost always done for selfish reasons. It's really important that we teach our friends and our players' parents to ask the right questions when they are approached by or voluntarily try out for another organization. I have no issue with a girl trying to better herself, but I have a big issue with girls and families getting sold the snake oil and then end up wasting a valuable year of their softball careers. I will not stoop to that level, and if that means I end up not having a quality team to coach the next year, then at least I will be able to live with myself.

 

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I assume your answer is a differently one in open try-out season than when season tryouts are not in session......

Yeah absolutely. Maybe it wasn't clear from my post. I look at tryout season like free agency. Coaches, parents and players look for the best situation for them. You can't steal or poach players during tryout season.

However, its not always the coaches fault if a kid goes back on their verbal commitment. What if a kid gets four offers and verbally commits to all of them so she doesn't loose any of them until she can pick the best offer. Three other coaches will be screaming, "poacher" when it isnt their fault at all. This team shuffling is a two way street, that's all I'm saying.

 

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So let me ask this .. we are in tryout season .. is it ok to contact a player/family on a team you saw last year and invite them to tryouts? Let them know that you are interested in having them on your team - or flat out making them an offer to join you no tryout needed?

most will say yes... since the season is in the book. Not a favorite thing to happen to you when it does.. but now's the time.

 

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Yes, it does seem to happen all the time.
Our young coaches talked to a couple parents last year (2010) after their daughters played with us in a tournament. It wasn't right and they did not see it as being wrong because they talked to the parents. We talked about it and they understand that it is wrong to do it. They were excited after a tournament we won with the girls from this other team playing with us, and told the PARENTS that they would love to have their daughters play for us next year (2011 season). I blame that on their youth.
Live and learn.

I've had a coach of another organization ask me to drop a bunch of the girls on my team and form some super team with members of their team. It was during the season when these talks were going on. In hindsight, I am so very glad it did not work out. My team is much better off now and we have turned the corner as an organization.
It happens to us all. It is the nature of the beast and if you do your job, in most instances, the kids will stay.

 

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So let me ask this .. we are in tryout season .. is it ok to contact a player/family on a team you saw last year and invite them to tryouts? Let them know that you are interested in having them on your team - or flat out making them an offer to join you no tryout needed?

This will probably be the most quoted response on this thread, because it is so rediculous. Doug, you know darn well this is OK. It happens all the time. It's how most of the better teams fill their roster.

100% legit

 

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Never during the season should the conversations take place. After the season and this time of year is Free Game for both sides via any means IE Phone,Facebook, email, youtube, Skywriting whatever....

 

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No problem at all. Make your offer, but do not disparage their current org. I feel that is the classy way to handle it.

I would inject; why are you offering the kid a position? Is it to better your team or to better the player? Or both? If it is only about your team or you looking better as a coach than it is always a bad thing in my opinion. If you can honestly provide an equal or better venue for the player to improve than it is a good thing. JMHO

I agree with this post -there are coaches who are in it for kids and those who are in it for themselves. By the **** that has went on the past few weeks in columbus this statement confirms the madness.

 

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Hilliarddad ... lol on the skywriting.

Doug, do we have a budget for that?