Pitching and Pitchers Discussion Picking pitches at 10u?

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While I was watching my niece play at Dayton this weekend, I saw a 10u coach yelling out to his batters what the pitcher was going to throw. For example, "Change up...BOOM!" My own DD has been playing travel ball for 6 years and this is the first time I have come across something like this. Maybe I am over thinking this, but it struck a nerve with me. Classless is about the only word that comes to mind. If you are not teaching your players to recognize and adjust to the pitch for themselves, you shouldn't interject yourself into a let's game to compensate for your shortcomings as a coach.

Am I way off base here?

 

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While I was watching my niece play at Dayton this weekend, I saw a 10u coach yelling out to his batters what the pitcher was going to throw. For example, "Change up...BOOM!" My own DD has been playing travel ball for 6 years and this is the first time I have come across something like this. Maybe I am over thinking this, but it struck a nerve with me. Classless is about the only word that comes to mind. If you are not teaching your players to recognize and adjust to the pitch for themselves, you shouldn't interject yourself into a let's game to compensate for your shortcomings as a coach.

Am I way off base here?

As the tournament director is was not happy with this bump in the road. It was not the normal hey 2 strikes watch the change up. It was pitcher starting wind up "crush this change up BOOM!!" 4 times in a row. They crushed each one. It may be part of the game but I don't think at 10's it should be. I wont take away from that team they are very very solid. There parents can be load and over the top but it is what it is. I have no problem with that just the pitch calling I do. Head coach even said I'm sorry to blue after the confernce about it and they kept doing it. Untill the pitcher looked over and said "would you like to call my pitches for me"?

 

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California........Florida.........

Seriously, some teams think that is part of the game.........at the older ages it is tougher if only for the fact that the pace of the game is so high. You will see girls on 2nd signalling into the batter if they can. Honestly, 90% of all pitches tip their pitches. If a batter is looking for the differences they can get an advantage.

With that said, the top pitchers are usually so filthy that they could yell out he pitch and still be successful. A few years ago UCLA had a pitcher that as far as I could tell threw 1 pitch. A rising twisting screw ball. I swear the catcher was not even giving signs. Just flashing location and getting ready for the twisting ball coming her way.

 

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I do agree it's a bit cheep at 10U to be calling out pitches and it probably confused the batter more than helped but...
This is a good argument for the pitchers to learn to Hide their grip.


You would have thought he would have learned calling out pitches doesn’t work after watching Clint Meyers from ASU doing it to Blare Luna in the WS. (Of course they did have to take Luna out).

 

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I do agree it's a bit cheep at 10U to be calling out pitches and it probably confused the batter more than helped but...
This is a good argument for the pitchers to learn to Hide their grip.


You would have thought he would have learned calling out pitches doesn’t work after watching Clint Meyers from ASU doing it to Blare Luna in the WS. (Of course they did have to take Luna out).

No it did not hurt the batter, this is the cream of the crop 10u hitters in OH at 10u. Soon as they heard it was a change up seconds before release that sat back waited on the floater and jacked the ball.

 

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As the tournament director is was not happy with this bump in the road. It was not the normal hey 2 strikes watch the change up. It was pitcher starting wind up "crush this change up BOOM!!" 4 times in a row. They crushed each one. It may be part of the game but I don't think at 10's it should be. I wont take away from that team they are very very solid. There parents can be load and over the top but it is what it is. I have no problem with that just the pitch calling I do. Head coach even said I'm sorry to blue after the confernce about it and they kept doing it. Untill the pitcher looked over and said "would you like to call my pitches for me"?

Wow - this is funny. I was there the entire weekend and I never heard the chant from the coach 'crush this change up BOOM' And even if it was said it is the game. If you want to play at the highest level, why would the game be any different for 10's as it is for 18's? Why is it okay for older girls...that's just talking out of both sides of you mouth, IMHO.

I think this is a little stretch of what happened. But people will choose to find something to complain about I guess.

All and all it was a good tournament.

 

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Wow - this is funny. I was there the entire weekend and I never heard the chant from the coach 'crush this change up BOOM' And even if it was said it is the game. If you want to play at the highest level, why would the game be any different for 10's as it is for 18's? Why is it okay for older girls...that's just talking out of both sides of you mouth, IMHO.

I think this is a little stretch of what happened. But people will choose to find something to complain about I guess.

All and all it was a good tournament.

you must of went to the bathroom. I was at the dug the entire time it was yelled and blue even called a conference with the coach and said I dont wanna throw anyone out for unsportsman like conduct.

I'm not taking anything away from them they were stroking the ball anyway.

 

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I wasn't there so I have no idea what was said or who said it, but I think it is always "bush" for adults (coaches or fans) to yell out pitches or pitch locations at youth games, no matter the age and no matter how they do it (i.e., picking up the signal, or a "tell"). I don't have any issue with coaches teaching their kids how to pick up "tells" from the pitcher, and the kids can yell whatever they want ... they are the ones playing the game against other kids.

 

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question - How were the tippers picking up the tell ? grip on the ball ? from the bench ? From the catcher ?

 

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No it did not hurt the batter, this is the cream of the crop 10u hitters in OH at 10u. Soon as they heard it was a change up seconds before release that sat back waited on the floater and jacked the ball.

That’s has to be very good awareness at 10u - Makes me assume it's not the first time Coach had called out the pitches


PITCHERS LERN TO HIDE YOUR PITCHES!

 

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There are much more subtle ways of doing this. Call the batter by her number = change up, first name = fastball, etc. We've picked up on this when we realize other teams were picking our signs. Kind of the same thing, but with more class and most spectators have no idea it's going on.

Personally I prefer to let my hitters read the ball from the release. Pitchers miss signs and locations all the time. The release never lies. And you never know when the other team will decide to go "old school" on one of your kids.

 

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Obviously, neither of you have ever played competitive ball on any level, or completely have no idea of the intensity 10 year olds CAN have for the game, and their performance. "Sign stealing" is a part of the game always has been, and always will be. Why do you think the coaches HIDE bunt signals with a miriade of motions? It appauls me to think that you all have such disrespect for the 10 year olds, and think they may not have the drive, desire, and game to compete. Most of these young women spend countless hours taking lessons, practising, and drilling themselves into better players. Many play "up" and take their lumps to get better and LEARN. Some of these so called "10 year olds" are already making plans for their futures in this game and where it can take them. Oh, but they are so young this is not the normal. You might forget, these young ladies may be far more mature than you realize, and have more than average pride in what they can accomplish. IF you were there, these "calls" were not just coming from the bench, they were coming from the stands also. It was obvious that there were 2 pitches being thrown, fastball and change up...period. And the young ladies were using the change up very effectively. It took great courage for the pitcher to bring this out, but I'm not sure I would have put MY pitcher in that position. I coached boys softball for many years, including travel ball for the 7-12 year old brackets. We went to the USSSA World for that period and winning it the last year. It was my task to "chart" the teams we played, indicating all batting stats, throwing ability, speed, and fielding ability for the teams we were going to face. And YES, we did call out to the field what they could possibly be looking at and for. From what you're insinuating this was wrong? It's part of the GAME. I even had one team change uniforms (numbers) to try to confuse my scouting reports. In spite of the "change up" situation you are blowing way out of context, the teams had excellent games. I don't think this situation affected their play as much as it ruffled the parents wings.......

 

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as I mentioned in the ASA tourney thread .. tell your pitcher ... You hear " cream the change" throw a fastball . aim for the inside corner. I'm just guessing ( well not really I guarantee it) the first time the lil slugger gets caught either A) caught looking for a 3rd strike or B) accidentally gets one on the shin bone or wrist ( 10u's get rattled as pitches just go anywhere) then she might tell Mr Big League Coach -- " I think we might to rethink this pitch calling out thing" IF .. IF IF IF we are going to approach 10u as 16-18u then the pitcher would already know to what I suggested BUT since these are sweet innocent 10's and the 10u coach's are deciding thats how we are going to approach the game then no complaints when the pitchers take the same approach.
What I'd really prefer is the defensive team and the pitcher hide their signs well enough to where the offensive team doesnt know whats coming . Thats what should be going on .

 

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question - How were the tippers picking up the tell ? grip on the ball ? from the bench ? From the catcher ?

from the coaches signs to the catcher i'd assume. after it happened the coach turned his legs and called the catcher over i'd assume to tell her new signs.

 

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Wow - this is funny. I was there the entire weekend and I never heard the chant from the coach 'crush this change up BOOM' And even if it was said it is the game. If you want to play at the highest level, why would the game be any different for 10's as it is for 18's? Why is it okay for older girls...that's just talking out of both sides of you mouth, IMHO.

I think this is a little stretch of what happened. But people will choose to find something to complain about I guess.

All and all it was a good tournament.

Don't know what game you were watching but it most certainly happened!!!! Blue called time and spoke with the head coach about it!!!! And by the way the pitchers change up was really effective until the yelling and pitch picking started!!!!

 

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Obviously, neither of you have ever played competitive ball on any level, or completely have no idea of the intensity 10 year olds CAN have for the game, and their performance. "Sign stealing" is a part of the game always has been, and always will be. Why do you think the coaches HIDE bunt signals with a miriade of motions? It appauls me to think that you all have such disrespect for the 10 year olds, and think they may not have the drive, desire, and game to compete. Most of these young women spend countless hours taking lessons, practising, and drilling themselves into better players. Many play "up" and take their lumps to get better and LEARN. Some of these so called "10 year olds" are already making plans for their futures in this game and where it can take them. Oh, but they are so young this is not the normal. You might forget, these young ladies may be far more mature than you realize, and have more than average pride in what they can accomplish. IF you were there, these "calls" were not just coming from the bench, they were coming from the stands also. It was obvious that there were 2 pitches being thrown, fastball and change up...period. And the young ladies were using the change up very effectively. It took great courage for the pitcher to bring this out, but I'm not sure I would have put MY pitcher in that position. I coached boys softball for many years, including travel ball for the 7-12 year old brackets. We went to the USSSA World for that period and winning it the last year. It was my task to "chart" the teams we played, indicating all batting stats, throwing ability, speed, and fielding ability for the teams we were going to face. And YES, we did call out to the field what they could possibly be looking at and for. From what you're insinuating this was wrong? It's part of the GAME. I even had one team change uniforms (numbers) to try to confuse my scouting reports. In spite of the "change up" situation you are blowing way out of context, the teams had excellent games. I don't think this situation affected their play as much as it ruffled the parents wings.......

No one is insulting the 10's ability to play. I coach 10's. I do not look in between the coaches legs and tell my batters what sign he just called. I think catching a pitchers tell is part of the game not stealing a sign. IMO

 

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from the coaches signs to the catcher i'd assume. after it happened the coach turned his legs and called the catcher over i'd assume to tell her new signs.

thought I read where it happened multiple times ? If so thats the coach's responsibility to clean it up . Not after his pitcher gets her change crushed several times .

 

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Don't know what game you were watching but it most certainly happened!!!! Blue called time and spoke with the head coach about it!!!! And by the way the pitchers change up was really effective until the yelling and pitch picking started!!!!

Okay - I may have been in the restroom (which by the way where great and always clean) but why is the ump getting involved with sign stealing? This is all very strange to me. Is it in the ASA rule book that coach's are not to steal signs? If they are caught is it an automate ball because if it is then I need to get a new rule book because I have never seen it. None of it makes any sense. From what I saw, that Lasers team hit quite well...pitch calling or not.

 

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thought I read where it happened multiple times ? If so thats the coach's responsibility to clean it up . Not after his pitcher gets her change crushed several times .

I agree, he did after 4 in a row in a 2 min period.

 

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Hpifm ... if you're referring to me and what I said, I stand by my opinion. Nothing wrong with charting hitters and pitchers, and positioning and/or educating your team accordingly. But I think coaches yelling out tells in the middle of pitches crosses what is admittedly a blurry line ... just my opinion. I've coached youth baseball/softball for over 25 years, and certainly have followed it a lot longer. And you're way off base saying this opinion "disrespects" ten year olds ... that's actually quite humorous. And once again, I was not at this event and was not a witness as to what happened ... just offering my opinion on the general subject.