Pet peeve stats

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I keep stats for travel ball for years. I follow high school closely and I'm not sure if schools don't know how to keep stats or they are blatant in inflating stats. I know many college coaches I have talked to , don't trust high school stats. Last night we played a team and I'm reading the paper and we had no errors. We had 6 and all runs were not earned against us. Of course they had 6 more hits than our books show. One was a hit into CF that the CF caught then dropped out of the glove. That was a double in paper. I know many conference's have addressed with with both head coaches agreeing to game stats at the end of the game. That seems to be a good policy , just wondering do many conferences have this policy.

 

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Re: Pet peve stats

I keep stats for travel ball for years. I follow high school closely and I'm not sure if schools don't know how to keep stats or they are blatant in inflating stats. I know many college coaches I have talked to , don't trust high school stats. Last night we played a team and I'm reading the paper and we had no errors. We had 6 and all runs were not earned against us. Of course they had 6 more hits than our books show. One was a hit into CF that the CF caught then dropped out of the glove. That was a double in paper. I know many conference have addressed with with both head coaches agreeing to game stats at the end of the game. That seems to be a good policy , just wondering do many conferences have this policy.

I have heard and this is pure hearsay as I would never say it myself, but there is at least one coach around here that considers a Hit as anytime his player 'hits' the ball with the bat and doesn't get out....

 

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Re: Pet peve stats

For the most part, opposing scorekeepers do not get together unless one of them initiates the conference.

Once this year so far I went to the opposing team after the game to discuss a particualr at-bat for one of their players. It was one of those close plays at 1st base that the throw was bobbled. Did she beat the throw before the bobble, yadda, yadda. We both agreed that in our opinion, the batter-runner beat the throw to the bag so we gave her a hit.

I feel your pain though as I know that you, like I, like to keep a fair, accurate, and unbiased book.

 

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Bill one error was my kid and I don't give anyone a break. It is what it is, you have to earn it. After a travel ball game, I discuss what I have with the other coaches to make sure we agree.

 

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Unfortunately high school stats are what they are, just like we sometimes have to tell our daughters that high school ball is what it is.
Some teams are very good and fair at keeping stats
Others are very bad, some intentionally to pad their players, some from incompetence, and others from just pure apathy.
It is what it is and as I have watched my daughter play (now a junior), I am thankful that I have learned to accept that.

 

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I don't even trust most college stats, let alone high school stats.

 

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It's very frustrating especially to the players who try to use those stats to improve their game. Most of ours aren't worth the paper they are written on. Add a parent who pads their own kid's and what a hot mess. I had to LOL at the comment from my DD's teammate after DD hit one out, "feels like the wind is blowing a little, so it will go down as error" The girls are fully aware they are getting cheated.

 

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In the Northern Lakes League, opposing scorekeepers are supposed to compare books at the end of the game. Whether that happens or not, I don't know.

 

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A ball can hit a players glove and still be a hit. A ball has to be able to be reasonably caught. If the centerfielder has to go and get it then it could be considered a hit, just as if a fielder dives for a ball or drops a popup..any of these could be a hit. Rule of thumb...mark it so it benefits your kid.

Can't see how comparing books would help...if I see it one way, what makes you think I will see it your way, especially if it hurts my kid.

 

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Just curious, is it the general opinion here that travel ball stats are better? If so why? It's the same volunteer parents with little training or experience keeping stats in TB as it is in HS.

 

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Just curious, is it the general opinion here that travel ball stats are better? If so why? It's the same volunteer parents with little training or experience keeping stats in TB as it is in HS.

I have to agree with you here.

It is not HS stats vs Travel Ball stats, it is incompetent scorekeeper vs competent scorekeeper, no matter what level of the sport.

I hope I didn't sugar-coat it too much.

 

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Reading local paper with stats. Two kids lead the area and that same team has 5 kids over 400 and those 5 kids have over 60 SB's. Now guess if they have a winning record or a losing record? They play in a league with very good pitching and very good catchers ?

 

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I am sure the answer is "losing record" .... obviously an issue with the scorekeeper or the statistician. While it's often the scorekeeper, sometimes it can be the person who gets the book and doesn't know how to do the stats.

 

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Reading local paper with stats. Two kids lead the area and that same team has 5 kids over 400 and those 5 kids have over 60 SB's. Now guess if they have a winning record or a losing record? They play in a league with very good pitching and very good catchers ?

Would love to play them!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

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I do the "official" stats for our HS team even though one of the players keeps a book in the dugout. I try to score all plays as if I were a neutral observer. There are times when I give the batter the benefit of the doubt - a line shot screamer that hits a third baseman in the glove (which is in front of her face) and bounces off is a hit. I call it the "I don't want to die" rule - a fielder in protection mode does not get an error.

Lots of other people have made good points - here are some of the "myths" I try to overcome.

+ The ball has to be touched to be an error. (No, a ball that rolls between a shortstop's legs, which should have been routine, is an error. I use "routine" as my guide.)

+ A ball that is touched by a fielder and dropped is always an error. (No, a player who makes a diving attempt or tips the ball after a long run in the outfield should not be penalized. That is a hit. Back to routine.)

+ Mental errors count as errors. (No, they don't. If a fielder forgets to cover a base, at best you have fielder's choice. ALTHOUGH, sometimes you can record an error there - long story.)

+ You should record an error when a throw should have beat the runner. (Well, either the ball was bobbled to the point where a routine play was missed, or it was a close play and the runner was called safe. Close plays are hits.)

+ A stolen base should be credited when a runner advanced unchallenged to the next base. (For example, runners on the corners. The runner on first heads to second, and the defense does not throw.) - WELL, by current college and other scoring guidelines, that IS a stolen base, and that is how I credit it. That could explain the high number of stolen bases in stats - those unchallenged bases.

 

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thing to keep in mind about stats also is who are they against. As i read the local stats it never cease to amaze me that girls that are generally high in avg, hits, ob% are generally the ones involved in games that are 15-11 and each pitcher gives up 20 hits. That same girl when against good pitching is 0-3.
I think there may be some merit to stats but one has to keep in mind the quality of pitching that some of these leaders may face.
In our league, WCAL we generally have good pitching. very few games are decided by the 10 run rule. To my knowledge only 2 games have been decided that way this year.

 

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I have to agree with you here.

It is not HS stats vs Travel Ball stats, it is incompetent scorekeeper vs competent scorekeeper, no matter what level of the sport.

I hope I didn't sugar-coat it too much.

Naaaaaaaa I think your right on the money.

 

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I do the "official" stats for our HS team even though one of the players keeps a book in the dugout. I try to score all plays as if I were a neutral observer.

+ A ball that is touched by a fielder and dropped is always an error. (No, a player who makes a diving attempt or tips the ball after a long run in the outfield should not be penalized. That is a hit. Back to routine.)

Would you please clone yourself so all area HS teams can use you?

 

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Last 4 league games.
4-2
7-0
8-1
5-1
so they only scored 4 runs ! Go figure

 

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Naaaaaaaa I think your right on the money.

Yes- I know of a number of travel teams that have "Cooked Books" as well. It goes back to the competence and honesty of the scorekeeper. The criteria for hits and errors should be the same no matter who it is - your team or the opponent.