Pet peeve stats

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Last 4 league games.
4-2
7-0
8-1
5-1
so they only scored 4 runs ! Go figure

This is the opposite of one travel pitcher that I saw get rocked at least 3x last summer and then I see on her berecruited profile her ERA from last summer was reported at 1.25.........The book you are referring to everything must be a hit and this other team's (or daddy's book) everything must be an error. In the 3 games I saw it did not look like a lot of errors (and only one of them was it against us so you can't say I wasn't objective)

 

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I do the "official" stats for our HS team even though one of the players keeps a book in the dugout. I try to score all plays as if I were a neutral observer. There are times when I give the batter the benefit of the doubt - a line shot screamer that hits a third baseman in the glove (which is in front of her face) and bounces off is a hit. I call it the "I don't want to die" rule - a fielder in protection mode does not get an error.

Lots of other people have made good points - here are some of the "myths" I try to overcome.

+ The ball has to be touched to be an error. (No, a ball that rolls between a shortstop's legs, which should have been routine, is an error. I use "routine" as my guide.)

+ A ball that is touched by a fielder and dropped is always an error. (No, a player who makes a diving attempt or tips the ball after a long run in the outfield should not be penalized. That is a hit. Back to routine.)

+ Mental errors count as errors. (No, they don't. If a fielder forgets to cover a base, at best you have fielder's choice. ALTHOUGH, sometimes you can record an error there - long story.)

+ You should record an error when a throw should have beat the runner. (Well, either the ball was bobbled to the point where a routine play was missed, or it was a close play and the runner was called safe. Close plays are hits.)

+ A stolen base should be credited when a runner advanced unchallenged to the next base. (For example, runners on the corners. The runner on first heads to second, and the defense does not throw.) - WELL, by current college and other scoring guidelines, that IS a stolen base, and that is how I credit it. That could explain the high number of stolen bases in stats - those unchallenged bases.

Those are great guidelines and I totally agree. You hit on most of the common "myths." Personally, I want to scream every time I hear "she touched it" or "she didn't touch it" as justification for an error or no error call. And as I have often reminded certain family members - "uneducated and/or unskilled (not our usual choice of terms) is not an error!"

A couple of other pet peeves:
1. People out there who count a baserunner's advancement on a passed ball or wild pitch as a stolen base. Duh.
2. Not giving the batter a sacrifice if they reach on error or fielder's choice. If it is clearly intended as a sacrifice and they beat out the bunt then it's a hit but if there is an error involved or the fielder attempts another runner for some reason, the batter should not be penalized in their batting average.

 

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The bottom line I think is that not enough coaches and scorekeepers care enough to keep an accurate book. You have some people like wvan and sideliner who we know keep an accurate book, but it is clear that they care and are competent.

Just the other day in our annual league coaches meeting for our NCAA D3 conference, all of us coaches agreed that the competence of the scorekeeping must be addressed. The SIDs are in charge and often hire students to keep the official score since they can't be at every home sport at one time. These students often receive poor training and many simply have no clue on how to keep a scorebook. Wild pitches get scored as stolen bases, a smash to third base will be scored an error, a fly ball to right that moves the runner from second to third will be scored a sac fly, and so on.

We had a girl lose a hit this year on a ground ball between short and third that was touched by neither and went into left field. The scorekeeper thought the third baseman could have made the play had she really gone all out.

 

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If those that are keeping the books just asked the other coaches what they thought most of this stuff would go away. If there is something that I'm not sure of I ask one of the other BH coaches. Then I have on line excel stats that our team has for our players on our web site. On our high school team our head coach has no idea what is in the book.

 

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Just curious how many HS coaches are reconstructing the inning when calculating ERAs. When I see a dropped fly ball that is foul (and obviously nothing in the book records this) and that same batter / runner scores or drives in a run, I cringe because I know that run will probably go down as earned. I'm guessing the ERA is the most inaccurate stat published.

 

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BPM ... I am sure you are right about ERA's being the most inaccurate ... have seen all of the above done incorrectly, including at the college level as well. At the college level, whatever the home team puts in the system pretty much goes automatically into the visiting team stats and you really can't change it no matter how wrong it may be ... short of your people calling their people and convincing them they did it wrong, if they even saw or remembered themselves what happened.

 

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coachjwb:

We do that quite often in our league, that is, call the other school and try to get something fixed. Usually the SID will question his head coach and make the change if the SID wasn't the one keeping the book and the coach doesn't disagree. Our SID does the communicating.

Our game has scoring errors that colleges would never dream of allowing to occur in football or basketball.

 

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Just curious how many HS coaches are reconstructing the inning when calculating ERAs. When I see a dropped fly ball that is foul (and obviously nothing in the book records this) and that same batter / runner scores or drives in a run, I cringe because I know that run will probably go down as earned. I'm guessing the ERA is the most inaccurate stat published.

I agree- ERAs are often not right for a number of reasons, including the situation you note. Also, sometimes the coach has to reconstruct what the error was (a throwing error allowing a runner to advance vs. one that resulted in an out not being recorded) and many scorekeepers who don't know the difference between a WP and PB. If the runner reached or scored via a WP it is an earned run (it is on the pitcher like a walk) while if it is the reuslt of a PB it is not (basically an error on the catcher)

 

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A few years ago one of the girl's mom did the official book for the high school team. Her scoring guidelines were tougher and stricter than MLB, unless it applied to her daughter. She would charge errors despite bad hops or balls hit exceptionally hard, or if she felt a player wasn't properly positioned( too deep or shallow ). The last game of that season her daughter should have been charged with 4 or 5 errors, but only received 1, while LF was charged 1 for getting burnt and RF got 1 for being too deep and having a ball drop in front of her. Ironically the year end stats had her daughter with only 10 e's when she easily should have had twice that many( and that's being conservative ). She also ended up 2nd in batting average. To me, this was as bad or worse than coaches who cook books.

 

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A few years ago one of the girl's mom did the official book for the high school team. Her scoring guidelines were tougher and stricter than MLB, unless it applied to her daughter. She would charge errors despite bad hops or balls hit exceptionally hard, or if she felt a player wasn't properly positioned( too deep or shallow ). The last game of that season her daughter should have been charged with 4 or 5 errors, but only received 1, while LF was charged 1 for getting burnt and RF got 1 for being too deep and having a ball drop in front of her. Ironically the year end stats had her daughter with only 10 e's when she easily should have had twice that many( and that's being conservative ). She also ended up 2nd in batting average. To me, this was as bad or worse than coaches who cook books.

I fault the HS coaching staff for apparently abandoning its responsibility to see that that stats being kept are not totally unreasonable. At some point this scorekeeper either needed to be replaced or she needed to be moved into the dugout and instructed what to enter on each error/hit determination.

It's one thing to leave a pro like sidewinder outside of the dugout while scoring, but this either clueless or agenda-drive scorekeeper needed close supervision.

(BTW, sidewinder, sorry I didn't catch you for a quick hi at Bishop Ready last Saturday; you were hard at work during the Alder game and then we left quickly so we could catch some games at Big Walnut).

 

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I have done the scorebook for DD tb team the last 5 years. I found a website , the National Fastpitch Coaches Association ( http://nfca.org.ismmedia.com/ISM2/MultimediaManager/ATEC.pdf ). They break down the offense and defense and give you many different scenerios under each category. It has helped me to reference the
" judgement calls " so I can try to get the correct scoring result.

 

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Aside from incompetence, inconsistency, parent score keepers giving their own kid breaks, etc... you also have all stats for all levels lumped into one list in the local paper.

You can't you realistically compare the stats of girls playing HS D-I vs D-IV.

Same goes in travel ball. You can throw numbers on your profiles but .500 vs. junk competition means squat.

I know I personally have also seen some interesting numbers on profiles. Would have never known it was the same kid that was on my DD's team if it weren't for the picture.

 

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...You can't you realistically compare the stats of girls playing HS D-I vs D-IV.

Be careful of assumptions and stereotypes. At least in our area, DI doesn't automatically mean good and DIV doesn't automatically mean bad.

 

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I have done the scorebook for DD tb team the last 5 years. I found a website , the National Fastpitch Coaches Association ( www.nfca.org ). They break down the offense and defense and give you many different scenerios under each category. It has helped me to reference the
" judgement calls " so I can try to get the correct scoring result.

It's called ATEC. I swear even after 8 years I still learn something new every time I use it. Here is the direct link: http://nfca.org.ismmedia.com/ISM2/MultimediaManager/ATEC.pdf

 

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Great post. I hope some of the stat keepers read or print these out. I have had some conversation about FC wth some high school score keepers that need to read the FC rules, because they are not doing them correctly.

 

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A pitcher in our league has an 11-10 record and given up 72 runs. The coach lists her ERA at .854. That means that 56 of the runs she allowed were unearned. Hard to believe

 

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Great post. I hope some of the stat keepers read or print these out. I have had some conversation about FC wth some high school score keepers that need to read the FC rules, because they are not doing them correctly.

No kidding! FC is the one I had the most recent "disagreement" with an opposing scorekeeper. They wanted to give their batter a hit instead of a FC when the lead runner was out at home on the play. A ground ball went to center fielder who fired it home for the out. They insisted that since the runner was coming from 2nd base the batter gets a hit?!?! ummm..... ATEC, page 22, item #3.

 

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I don't even trust most college stats, let alone high school stats.

I was looking at a clooege box score and saw that only 3 of the 6 runes were earned but when I looked for errors and passed balls their were none. I assume the host team does the official book and this was the line for the visitors.

 

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JES4. Might want to read page 16.

 

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No kidding! FC is the one I had the most recent "disagreement" with an opposing scorekeeper. They wanted to give their batter a hit instead of a FC when the lead runner was out at home on the play. A ground ball went to center fielder who fired it home for the out. They insisted that since the runner was coming from 2nd base the batter gets a hit?!?! ummm..... ATEC, page 22, item #3.

;& ummm, a ground ball to CF and your not going to score it as a hit? Very rarely is the CF ever going to make the out at first, so yes that is a hit...