Rules Question

[default]

Last night in a HS game the following scenario played out:
2 outs and runner on 3rd. Hitter lines a pitch down 3rd base line in foul territory, which hits the runner who is standing in foul territory. Ump rules runner and batter out- (yes that would be 4 outs). The batter is told later that your at bat wouldn't count, but I see in the box score this morning that it did count. I thought if the base runner is standing outside of field of play and is hit that this is a foul ball? Also, why would the ump say batter is out too?

 

[default]

One more. Last weekend hitter is in the box and foul tips the ball and the foul tip ball hits the bat again again while hitter maintains control of the bat. Batter is ruled out- told that ball can't hit bat twice. I thought that only applied if batter is out of the box?

 

[default]

In the first scenario, it is a foul ball and there should be no out recorded unless perhaps the base runner somehow purposely interfered/obstructed the fielder's chance to catch the ball, though that would appear to be pretty unlikely since it was a line drive. Had the runner been in fair territory, of course there can never be 4 outs, but that does constitute an at bat and the next batter in the lineup would be up to start the next inning.

In the second scenario, I'm not sure I understand how a foul tip could be hit again while the batter was still holding on to the bat, but that would not be an out.

 

[default]

In the first scenario, it is a foul ball and there should be no out recorded unless perhaps the base runner somehow purposely interfered/obstructed the fielder's chance to catch the ball, though that would appear to be pretty unlikely since it was a line drive. Had the runner been in fair territory, of course there can never be 4 outs, but that does constitute an at bat and the next batter in the lineup would be up to start the next inning.

I would say the umpire is ruling that the ball was still in the field of play and not foul. Ball hit the baserunner in the helmet (line drive), but the hitter and mom felt it made contact with runner while she was not in base line.

In the second scenario, I'm not sure I understand how a foul tip could be hit again while the batter was still holding on to the bat, but that would not be an out.

This is a Slapper- makes contact with the ball while power slapping and foul tip comes back down and makes contact with bat in the box- I would think this would be a dead ball.

Thank you for the reply.

 

[default]

I think it is a judgement call on the second one. Remember not all of the batters box is in foul territory. If the umpire felt the fouled ball was back in play when it hit the bat again it would be an out. What I would like to hear from an umpire is that could the umpire "assume" the ball was coming back into play and the second hit interfered with that - thus the out call.

 

[default]

Last night in a HS game the following scenario played out:
2 outs and runner on 3rd. Hitter lines a pitch down 3rd base line in foul territory, which hits the runner who is standing in foul territory. Ump rules runner and batter out- (yes that would be 4 outs). The batter is told later that your at bat wouldn't count, but I see in the box score this morning that it did count. I thought if the base runner is standing outside of field of play and is hit that this is a foul ball? Also, why would the ump say batter is out too?

That would be tops on bad calls so far this spring. Perhaps a JUDGMENT CALL made saying she was NOT in foul territory??? On the 4 outs- I think "Do Not Pass Go- Do Not Collect $200" Go Directly to Park Place. This makes a NO Call on a pitched ball look normal.

 

[default]

Ahh OK, I get it now ... wasn't picturing it right the first time ... yes, that could potentially be an out, though I still think it would be pretty unlikely ...

 

[default]

Most slappers tries to make contact in very front of box (closest to pitchers) and next step would be towards a pitcher (out of the box).. Maybe ump figured 2nd contact with bat was out of box.

 

[default]

This was posted in other rules thread by General's Dad and which appears to apply here in second scenario ... if bat is still in batter's hand, it's a foul ball unless it's intentional ...

Federation rules...7-13...Batter is out...After hitting or bunting a ball, the bat hits the ball a second time while the ball is on or over fair territory, or is on or over foul territory and, in the umpires judgment had a chance to become a fair ball. Exception: If the batter is in the batters box and the bat is in the batters hand when the second contact occurs, it is a foul ball regardless of whether the ball was on or over fair or foul territory unless, in the umpires judgment, the batter intentionally hit the ball a second time. Penalty: The batter is out. All runners must return to the base occupied at the time of pitch. 5-1-1b, this is a dead ball. Blue got it right.

 

[default]

... and foul tips the ball and the foul tip ball hits the bat again again while hitter maintains control of the bat...

A foul tip goes directly from the bat to the catcher's glove. What you described was a foul ball, not foul tip.

 

[default]

Last night in a HS game the following scenario played out:
2 outs and runner on 3rd. Hitter lines a pitch down 3rd base line in foul territory, which hits the runner who is standing in foul territory. Ump rules runner and batter out- (yes that would be 4 outs). The batter is told later that your at bat wouldn't count, but I see in the box score this morning that it did count. I thought if the base runner is standing outside of field of play and is hit that this is a foul ball? Also, why would the ump say batter is out too?

Was the ball past F5 when it hit the runner? If so, that pretty well eliminates any call of interference on a line drive down the foul line, unless it was intentional.

Regardless of fair or foul, the umpire can call interference if a fielder had a routine play to catch the fly ball. Under ASA rules, the batter would also be out (see Exception under 8-7L) - however I don't see that provision under NFHS rules.

If the ball wasn't over fair territory - including the foul line - when it touched the runner, it is a foul ball. It doesn't matter where the runner is standing.

If the ball was over fair territory and hadn't passed F5 yet, it would be runner interference, the batter would be awarded 1B and the AB would be scored as FC according to NFHS rules (scoring varies by sanction's rules).

NFHS 8-6 PENALTY: (Arts. 10 through 14) The ball is dead and the runner is out. Each other runner must return to the last base touched at the time of the interference. When a runner is called out for interference, the batter-runner is awarded first base and credited with a fielder's choice.

 

[default]

On the first one: If a runner is hit by a batted ball over foul ground, it is simply a foul ball unless it is judged that the runner intentionally contacted the ball. If intentional, then the ball is dead and the runner is out. With respect to the batter, same rules apply as any other time a batter hits a foul ball.

On the second one: If the batter is still in the batter's box when the bat (still in the batter's hands) contacts the ball a second time, then it is a foul ball. If the batter is out of the box, then it is interference (dead ball, batter out).

 

[default]

On the first one: If a runner is hit by a batted ball over foul ground, it is simply a foul ball unless it is judged that the runner intentionally contacted the ball. If intentional, then the ball is dead and the runner is out. With respect to the batter, same rules apply as any other time a batter hits a foul ball.

What if it was unintentional and F5's glove was behind the runner in position to catch the fly ball?

 

[default]

What if it was unintentional and F5's glove was behind the runner in position to catch the fly ball?

Foul ball.

 

[default]

What if it was unintentional and F5's glove was behind the runner in position to catch the fly ball?

We need replay on this forum. Upon further review...

The answer I typed would apply if the runner was hit by a batted ball, over foul territory, while still in contact with the base. After re-reading the first post, I see that contact with the base isn't specified.

So, if the runner was hit over foul ground while not in contact with the base..foul ball. But, if the contact (either intentionally or unintentionally) prevented a fielder from making a routine catch of the ball, then the runner is out and the batter is also out. If no catch was prevented, then it's just a plain old foul ball.

 

[default]

We need replay on this forum. Upon further review...

The answer I typed would apply if the runner was hit by a batted ball, over foul territory, while still in contact with the base. After re-reading the first post, I see that contact with the base isn't specified.

So, if the runner was hit over foul ground while not in contact with the base..foul ball. But, if the contact (either intentionally or unintentionally) prevented a fielder from making a routine catch of the ball, then the runner is out and the batter is also out. If no catch was prevented, then it's just a plain old foul ball.

This was a HS game. I couldn't find the provision for the batter also being out in the 2011 NFHS rules. Did I miss it?

 

[default]

I'm still a little off today!

Batter is out in ASA ball. In high school, the batter is charged with a foul ball, but not out.