Travel Ball Playing Time

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Just wondering how playing time typically works on travel teams. Is it similar to varsity ball in high school where there is a set starting lineup and the reserve players rarely play? Or is it more equally divided given the $800-$1000 to join the team? Or is it something else?

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance

It is how the team is presented. Hopefully the coach of the team has stated how playing time will be distributed and under what conditions, or something that conveys that information.

Typically there are a few situations
- Level of effort during practices and games determines if you will be given anything other than minimal play.
- More playing time during pool play then the "best 9" plays during the tournament phase.
- Each player plays in each game but maybe not equal innings.
- And 1000 other combinations.

The cost to play on the team usually has nothing to do with playing time though if things are not clear up front on how that time is determined it can be a point of contention. One thing that parents and coaches alike need to be aware of is being transparent on where the player stands on the team at different points in time. Did the player just barely make the team out of tryouts and the coach has made it clear they just see her getting in occasionally? Is there opportunity for that to change (there should be)? If the player isn't getting in at all is it because of ability, attitude, effort or what? Private communication is the key to understanding and then you go from there on what to do about it.

Quite often this isn't a case of mom or dad thinking they have a super-star when in reality they don't, it is usually a matter of communication. Many jump to the parent having a perception issue and while that is true to some degree it isn't the majority of situations.

 

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Pickle, CGS,
I know some whos kids sat the entire weekend at major tournies, whiule the subs played the whole thing...

Ah well, if that's the situation you are talking about, we are on the same page. I use the term "ringer" for this version of "sub" and I certainly don't condone that either.

I interpreted your initial post to say that if a sub is playing at any time while a regular roster player is sitting, that would be wrong. Unless the team for that tournament has only nine players including the sub, you have to sit a regular roster player to give the sub any playing time and we are committed to having guest players get into the games and not just ride the pine.

We once had a parent pull his daughter from our team on the Saturday night of a tournament because a guest player was in a game while his daughter was not. I know that we had started all our roster players in at least one game before we put the guest into a starting line-up. In any event while it was a horrible weekend dealing with the drama, the guest player has been with us ever since and is now our usual number four hitter so I guess it was all for the best.

 

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Ah well, if that's the situation you are talking about, we are on the same page. I use the term "ringer" for this version of "sub" and I certainly don't condone that either.

I interpreted your initial post to say that if a sub is playing at any time while a regular roster player is sitting, that would be wrong. Unless the team for that tournament has only nine players including the sub, you have to sit a regular roster player to give the sub any playing time and we are committed to having guest players get into the games and not just ride the pine.

We once had a parent pull his daughter from our team on the Saturday night of a tournament because a guest player was in a game while his daughter was not. I know that we had started all our roster players in at least one game before we put the guest into a starting line-up. In any event while it was a horrible weekend dealing with the drama, the guest player has been with us ever since and is now our usual number four hitter so I guess it was all for the best.

Hilliard / CGS,

Ditto your thoughts, ... especially the "ringer" who is brought in for trophies vs the "needed sub" because the team needs a body to play. We probably agree in general from what I am reading. We definitely prefer to dance with who "brung us" through better or worse, thick and thin, win or lose. But if we need to "field a team" whomever is there for us will get rewarded in return (relatrively speaking), or at least we will try. But we are also more flexible with the regulars when they have other obligations, so we need to treat our quality subs well (not that we wouldn't anyway) lol.

It's good to hear and learn some other perspectives on this, because these can be headaches and chemistry killers!

 

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Yeah I just phrased it wrong when I typed it....

 

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I do think it makes a difference with what level you are playing at ... and most important of all is communicating your philosophy in advance. Similar to most travel coaches, ours is everyone will get starts and playing time (not even) in pool games, but we play to win on Sunday so that time has to be earned. With that being said, there are still going to be people who think their DD's should be playing more. My recommendation to any new coaches is that you keep very thorough stats including on the number of games played, plate appearances and innings played defensively, so you have all of the facts to ensure you are both keeping consistent with your own philosophies and so you can use this info in any discussions with parents or players on the subject. You also have to be honest with the players (and their parents) playing less as to what they need to get better at to play more.

 

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Of the couple of discussions running through this thread, I will add one thought without offering an opinion on playing time. With the culture of automatic playing time entrenched in travel ball, many (perhaps most) girls arrive at college with an incredible sense of entitlement. If they aren't playing, they are incredulous as to how THEY could be sitting the bench. All the talks in the world during the recruiting process about earning playing time go unheeded, as many girls never dream bench-sitting could apply to them.

When you think about it, girls who play in college have probably never had to compete for playing time until then. They were easily good enough to start in high school and got automatic playing time in travel ball, so having pressure put on them to perform just to earn playing time is traumatic for many girls.

Having said all of that, I've been there coaching travel teams, so I know how much easier it is to just have 10-12 players and make sure everyone gets a decent amount of playing time. But it does put off the inevitable fact of having to compete for playing time until they reach college.

 

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This is insane, the decision of whether or not a girl gets playing time in travel ball should definitely be because of her skill level, not the amount of money it costs to join the team. Although, shame on any coach that would accept a player on their team due to team's expenses. My theory on travel ball is, every girl on any given team should be able to fill the shoes of the starting player at her position. The coach should not cringe because he has to put Sally in for Suzy. If he does, he is a complete idiot and shouldn't be coaching travel ball. Parents wake up, not all of our DD's are travel ball players, I don't care how much money you got!

 

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This is insane, the decision of whether or not a girl gets playing time in travel ball should definitely be because of her skill level, not the amount of money it costs to join the team. Although, shame on any coach that would accept a player on their team due to team's expenses. My theory on travel ball is, every girl on any given team should be able to fill the shoes of the starting player at her position. The coach should not cringe because he has to put Sally in for Suzy. If he does, he is a complete idiot and shouldn't be coaching travel ball. Parents wake up, not all of our DD's are travel ball players, I don't care how much money you got!

Wow, You are thinking everyone should have YOUR idea of what travel ball is. That is YOUR idea and that is the type of team you should be on.

Many teams have the thought that if they put a girl on the team, she was good enough to make the team, she deserves some playing time.

Either way is great because it's whatever works for your team. The key is communication. If you only play the best nine, period then make sure everyone knows before signing up and you should really make sure they know. If everybody gets playing time make sure the parents and girls all know the best isn't on the field all the time. Anything in between should be communicated as well.

And not all travel ball players or teams are geared towards college scholarships. Travel isn't the elitist club you think it is.

 

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Let me clarify I guess. Might be helpful for my original question.

League is 16U
This is a new team for an long time, established program
There was no communication from the coach re: playing time
I am a travel ball newbie and did not know to ask

DD 1st weekend she played minimally in a 6 game tournament but went 3-7 with a walk and a double. The hits were versatile (bunt single up the 3rd base line, a single to right-center and then a double off the left field fence). Defensively she had no fielding issues.

She is a pitcher. She was decent but not great giving up 4 runs in 8 1/3 innings. She was not given the opportunity to play any other position. She is versatile enough defensively to play anywhere but catcher. In practice the coach works her at 1b.

This last weekend (her 2nd weekend) the coach rewarded her opening weekend hitting production with 3 plate appearances (walk, flyout and strike out) in 7 games. Again no defensive errors fielding. She pitched decent again but not great giving up 2 runs in 4 innings. She was not given the opportunity to play any other position. She is the only pitcher who has not been given an opportunity to play another position. Overall, she sat on the bench the entire game for 4 of the 7 games. In the other 3 games she got to play in 4 innings combined.

So as a travel ball newbie I am confused. If playing time is earned how does a "3-7 + a walk" weekend result in only three plate appearances in 7 games the following weekend especially for a team struggling to score runs (team scored 19 runs during the 7 games this weekend).

She is one of 3 players who have attended every practice. In addition she goes to the batting cage on her own twice per week and pitches 3-4 times per week year round.

So again how can playing time be earned if a player is only allowed to play in 4 innings during a 7 game weekend. Is this normal?

 

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We could only compare your DD's stats knowing what the other pitchers did. Either way you should talk to the coach and ask these questions. Find out what needs to be done for more playing time. If at the end of the year you are not happy try out for some other teams and ask how they handle things. Good Luck!

 

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4 Love of the Game:

You are in a very tough situation. Let's assume that the 7 games included 7 innings (and I know that it could have been fewer innings through mercy wins, home team being ahead, etc. etc).

I'm hearing that your daughter played 4 out of 49 innings this last weekend, or roughly 8% of the time with a scant three appearances at the plate.

Based on your post, I would speculate that your daughter was brought on to provide a pitching "safety net", that is, a pitcher who can be brought in if there is an injury to one of the other pitchers or if one of the other pitchers is suffering heat exhaustion, etc. etc. If my speculation is correct, I think it was just wrong for the coach not to explain that limited role when he invited your DD to join the team.

How many pitchers on your team? How many regular rostered players? If those numbers are high, it could be difficult indeed for your DD to get any kind of reasonable playing time.

I would give the situation one more tournament weekend and if things don't improve for your daughter I would have a calm but frank conversation with the coach. Preferably you could meet with him after practice or on a day/evening when there is no practice or tournament game. Ask him what role he has in mind for your DD on his team. Ask him what DD would need to do to get more playing time. State very calmly that playing less than 10% of the time is not what you or your DD envisioned when you joined the team. (If you know the number of innings for all tournaments that your daughter played relative to the total number of team innings for those tournaments, I'd use that percentage figure in the discussions so it doesn't appear that you are only selecting one tournament as the basis for your concern).

If you aren't satisfied with the coach's responses, then I think you and your DD need to discuss whether she would be happier staying with the team (is she learning from the practices and observing the game? does she have a rewarding sense of being a team member?) or whether the commitment required from her and her family just far outweighs the positives from the experience. It is unlikely that the team would refund your paid fees, but given the other costs of playing for the team, you would probably have a net financial gain by leaving the team.

It doesn't sound as though leaving the team would create any real crisis for the organization. I'm not one who lightly suggests that a player leave a team after having accepted an invitation, but your case strikes me as exceptionally difficult to stay with the team if you don't get answers suggesting that your DD can "earn" more playing time in future weeks. Playing 10% of the time, without having been informed at the time of the invitation that this was a real possibility, strikes me as justification for choosing to part ways.

 

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This is insane, the decision of whether or not a girl gets playing time in travel ball should definitely be because of her skill level, not the amount of money it costs to join the team. Although, shame on any coach that would accept a player on their team due to team's expenses. My theory on travel ball is, every girl on any given team should be able to fill the shoes of the starting player at her position. The coach should not cringe because he has to put Sally in for Suzy. If he does, he is a complete idiot and shouldn't be coaching travel ball. Parents wake up, not all of our DD's are travel ball players, I don't care how much money you got!

I agree with your thoughts - if the coach thought the girl was good enough to be on the team she deserves a reasonable amount of playing time. If they are just waiting to see if someone better shows up later shame on them. We have all had players that we did not invite back next year because we wanted to upgrade, but if they are on your team this year they deserve a reasonable amount of time.

 

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4 the love---

I agree with CGS except one thing... at 16 the conversation should come from her to the coaches first, asking what does she need to do to get more playing time. Stating that she has been to everything asked and seems to be working hard. You may be surprised in her and what they say. After that, then maybe you have your talk with them if nothing comes out of it.

Just my two cents, nothing more...

 

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Yep, Hilliarddad has it right that it would be better for your DD to have the talk with the coach. If she is too afraid to do that, however, I think it would be better for you to talk to the coach rather than just letting the situation fester.

 

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A coach I met a few years back put it this way:

Everybody plays during Pool Play. The best nine play in bracket play.

It seems a bit extreme to those riding the pine on Sunday, but it's a philosophically sound idea.

That's exactly how my dd team runs things.

 

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I agree with your philosophy HBTCB, all your girls should be good enough to play on Sunday, but travelball has become so watered down, sometimes you have to take what you can get.

 

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4 Love of the Game:

You are in a very tough situation. Let's assume that the 7 games included 7 innings (and I know that it could have been fewer innings through mercy wins, home team being ahead, etc. etc).

I'm hearing that your daughter played 4 out of 49 innings this last weekend, or roughly 8% of the time with a scant three appearances at the plate.

Based on your post, I would speculate that your daughter was brought on to provide a pitching "safety net", that is, a pitcher who can be brought in if there is an injury to one of the other pitchers or if one of the other pitchers is suffering heat exhaustion, etc. etc. If my speculation is correct, I think it was just wrong for the coach not to explain that limited role when he invited your DD to join the team.

How many pitchers on your team? How many regular rostered players? If those numbers are high, it could be difficult indeed for your DD to get any kind of reasonable playing time.

I would give the situation one more tournament weekend and if things don't improve for your daughter I would have a calm but frank conversation with the coach. Preferably you could meet with him after practice or on a day/evening when there is no practice or tournament game. Ask him what role he has in mind for your DD on his team. Ask him what DD would need to do to get more playing time. State very calmly that playing less than 10% of the time is not what you or your DD envisioned when you joined the team. (If you know the number of innings for all tournaments that your daughter played relative to the total number of team innings for those tournaments, I'd use that percentage figure in the discussions so it doesn't appear that you are only selecting one tournament as the basis for your concern).

If you aren't satisfied with the coach's responses, then I think you and your DD need to discuss whether she would be happier staying with the team (is she learning from the practices and observing the game? does she have a rewarding sense of being a team member?) or whether the commitment required from her and her family just far outweighs the positives from the experience. It is unlikely that the team would refund your paid fees, but given the other costs of playing for the team, you would probably have a net financial gain by leaving the team.

It doesn't sound as though leaving the team would create any real crisis for the organization. I'm not one who lightly suggests that a player leave a team after having accepted an invitation, but your case strikes me as exceptionally difficult to stay with the team if you don't get answers suggesting that your DD can "earn" more playing time in future weeks. Playing 10% of the time, without having been informed at the time of the invitation that this was a real possibility, strikes me as justification for choosing to part ways.

Very nice post.

 

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We could only compare your DD's stats knowing what the other pitchers did. Either way you should talk to the coach and ask these questions. Find out what needs to be done for more playing time. If at the end of the year you are not happy try out for some other teams and ask how they handle things. Good Luck!

Well put, always try to talk to the coach and find out what they are seeing versus you the parent, sometimes we all put our DD on a pedestal. Actually at 16U, I think the daughter should talk to the coach.

As for my playing time, I try to give everyone the same chances on Saturday and then Sunday we play accordingly based on the team we are facing. We do however have a player/parent handbook that clearly states our mission, goals and playing time expectations that we require the player and parent to sign off on. We will sometimes sit some of our better players on Saturday in easier games knowing they will play all day Sunday. This gives the other kids a chance to get more innings in on Saturday not feeling as left out then Sunday. Not really sure if that is how they take it, but I am hoping so.

 

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Hey thanks everyone for the feedback. It is a difficult situation so I appreciate the insights provided. Very helpful and hopefully we are able to find a resolution. Thanks again

 

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In pool play I try to play them all after all you are only as strong as your weakest player.
Sunday I put my best defense on the field.

Will also use DP/Flex to get another bat in lineup if girl hits better then one of the girls playing defense.