Pitching and Pitchers Discussion Is this a legal motion?

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Here is a young lady with mad skills and is legal. VERY nice rise ball too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgP2E5uK0Ik&feature=fvw

nice post! hmm got me thinking....does that RISE BALL REALLY RISE??? couldn't help it

 

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Great Pitcher and a great video no doubt. But i dont think that rise ball is actually rising. I think they are high fast balls that would not be strikes. But she is good no question.

 

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Great Pitcher and a great video no doubt. But i dont think that rise ball is actually rising. I think they are high fast balls that would not be strikes. But she is good no question.

The thing is, she has the proper spin on the rise, so, at least, it will not flaten out as fast. When we see her rise from an umps view, it looks like it would fool batters.

 

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Her push foot sliding forward is definately illegal. She obviously looks like she's a good pitcher from seeing her stats. However I'm not as impressed as some people are with her mechanics. She looks like she's muscling through all of her pitches. Not very smooth at all, and is cheating herself out of a lot of speed by not finishing hard against her front side. If you stop the vid on her finish you'll notice that she comes up on her front toe which just squashes her leg drive. She looks to me like the under hand version of an overhand baseball pitcher with that follow through. That's also why she probably doesn't have a riseball, she can't stay back on it. She has great arm speed, just think of how she would look if she worked hard against a flat front foot and slammed her back leg into it. HMHO....but maybe thats how they do things in Texas

 

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The thing is, she has the proper spin on the rise, so, at least, it will not flaten out as fast. When we see her rise from an umps view, it looks like it would fool batters.

I went back and watched. I do see what you mean.

 

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Talk about illegal. And it looks like she is on some type of turf. I know that throwing on a gym floor is tough. But if a girl can work through that, it will only make her better. I have seen girls 10-12 who are able to work through it without crow hopping or whatever you want to call it. It comes down to having solid mechanics.

 

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ok I am alittle confused here. I have read many post that you can't drive off on turf and its ok indoors....But does she or does she not take a step forward off of the PITCHING RUBBER then she drives off...If the pitching rubber moves because it is not secured, ok then follow what is legal and have just your heal touching the rubber and most of your foot on the turf and drive off like she does after she takes a step forward....

 

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Punchout -- I loved the Lindsay Rich video. Like somebody else in the thread said, i was struck by how effortless her motion seems, and the movement on her pitches. Whether the rise ball rises or not, it starts at her knee and the catcher catches it above her head. I can see where that would be a killer pitch.

 

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While the coaches and spectators may complain, It's never Illegal until the the Blue calls it!;&



FASTPITCH! Anything else, And you're playing to SLOW!

 

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Yep, its a Blue world, and we're just visiting.

 

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Surely she doesn't really do that in a game. It's about as blatantly illegal and OBVIOUS as could be. If an ump can't see that, then they may as well give up the job. My guess is she is doing it to pick up a little more speed for the video, sort of like how some pitchers walk through their warmup pitches. Not sure what the point is, any college coach would immediately see it as a problem.

 

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Surely she doesn't really do that in a game. It's about as blatantly illegal and OBVIOUS as could be. If an ump can't see that, then they may as well give up the job. My guess is she is doing it to pick up a little more speed for the video, sort of like how some pitchers walk through their warmup pitches. Not sure what the point is, any college coach would immediately see it as a problem.

Monica Abbott did this exact same thing, took that short step off the rubber before starting her motion. I have seen others do it.
I dont buy the excuse turf is hard to drive off and drag. This same kid drives hard AND DRAGS very well right after the illegal step. She has a bad habit.

 

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Here is Abbott sliding her foot sidways (legal) and then taking a little step forward in a game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXeaakhWOCg&feature=related

Here she is doing it in a demostration.. The bad habit transferred into her game pitching

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuWhhu7NJPk&feature=related

Here she is doing it in the olympics and throwing a perfect game. Hard to see because of the angle. But if you look closely, you can see the little step.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCF6mdzRPtI&feature=related

I rest my case.....lol

 

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Just from recalling Abbott pitching in various Olympic, World Cup and college competitions, I think that what she is doing is different than the pitcher on YouTube.

A pitcher CAN legally slide her pivot foot forward before delivering the pitch. Notice that I did not say "forward and off of the pitcher's plate". The rules allow the pitcher to slide her pivot foot across the top of the plate, as long as she maintains contact with the plate.

If she starts with her her toe just touching the back of the rubber, she can slide it forward until her heel is just touching the front of the rubber. That is legal and, with respect to the pitcher gaining some forward momentum, can have pretty much the same net effect as if she slides the foot illegally forward off of the plate.

The few illegal pitches I remember seeing Abbott called for were for a different infraction. When she first rocks back, her pivot foot raises. In doing that, she was (illegally) losing contact with the rubber, before bringing it back down and sliding it (legally) forward.

 

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Just from recalling Abbott pitching in various Olympic, World Cup and college competitions, I think that what she is doing is different than the pitcher on YouTube.

A pitcher CAN legally slide her pivot foot forward before delivering the pitch. Notice that I did not say "forward and off of the pitcher's plate". The rules allow the pitcher to slide her pivot foot across the top of the plate, as long as she maintains contact with the plate.

If she starts with her her toe just touching the back of the rubber, she can slide it forward until her heel is just touching the front of the rubber. That is legal and, with respect to the pitcher gaining some forward momentum, can have pretty much the same net effect as if she slides the foot illegally forward off of the plate.

The few illegal pitches I remember seeing Abbott called for were for a different infraction. When she first rocks back, her pivot foot raises. In doing that, she was (illegally) losing contact with the rubber, before bringing it back down and sliding it (legally) forward.

Oh really? what is different about this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuWhhu7NJPk&feature=related

I have watched Abbott both on TV and live, and trust me she steps forward off the rubber.
She has tamed it down over the last couple years, but to a point she still does it, at least on occation. She used to do it just like her demo tape shows, all the time.

 

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She doesn't seem to be sliding her pivot foot forward in this video. But she might be losing contact with the pitcher's plate as she repositions her foot.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/37608055@N05/3524712989/

Maybe this was after she "tamed it down".

 

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That pivot foot of hers is what got her in trouble in the last Olympics. She was NOT keeping in contact with the rubber. So even the BEST in the world can learn how to do it correctly. No one broke her of that bad habit in high school or at TN obviously.

 

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Too bad umps look the other way. They mostly want their money with a hassel free game. Ive heard umps say that they dont think the pitcher is gaining an advantage.. So I ask, where do you draw the line with hoppers? One foot? Two feet? 4 feet? Just where DOES it start to become an advantage.. Hint, there is no right answer, that is why they put in the rules which umps are paid to enforce........

 

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The 1st video is the Las Vegas Ninja step!! If your not closely watching, it sneaks up and will rob your team blind!

 

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ok I am alittle confused here. I have read many post that you can't drive off on turf and its ok indoors....But does she or does she not take a step forward off of the PITCHING RUBBER then she drives off...If the pitching rubber moves because it is not secured, ok then follow what is legal and have just your heal touching the rubber and most of your foot on the turf and drive off like she does after she takes a step forward....

I don't understand this myself. People seem to justify pitchers changing their mechanics indoors, or on a gym floor etc. My daughter is a pitcher (a very good pitcher) and her mechanics don't change whether she is on turf indoors, on a gym floor, or hanging in mid air attached to an airplane wing (the last part was suppose to be funny because I haven't hung her from an airplane wing.....YET). Anyway my point is that if they have bad habbits indoors more than likely they have the same bad habbits outdoors as well.